Focus on the Family's Jim Daly on what Christians can learn from Charlie Kirk's legacy

[00:00] Let's start by talking about Truth

[00:02] Rising. This takes on what you call a

[00:05] civilizational moment that we're living

[00:08] in. What compelled Focus on the Family

[00:10] to co-produce this film right now? Um,

[00:14] and why do you believe it's urgent for

[00:16] this generation?

[00:18] >> Yeah, I think it started, the thoughts

[00:19] started about two years ago, and I was

[00:21] looking at comedians. I mean, I'm trying

[00:24] to stay in touch with culture. So, I'm,

[00:26] you know, listening some of Dave

[00:28] Chappelle. I'm listening to Bill Maher

[00:31] and I'm thinking, "Wow, these are like

[00:33] canaries in the cave of culture."

[00:35] Meaning, they're saying things they're

[00:37] not supposed to be saying. And they're

[00:38] making fun of people you're not supposed

[00:41] to be making fun of. And I think it was

[00:43] the first breath of fresh air to be able

[00:47] to say, "Okay, so speech can be

[00:50] protected." I mean, they're trying. I

[00:52] think uh you know I think even other

[00:54] comedians that were struggling to tell

[00:56] jokes because humor was being lost. So

[01:00] that's what first caught my attention.

[01:02] And then the idea of whether or not we

[01:04] could capture these voices outside the

[01:07] church, non-Christians

[01:09] who were making these observations that

[01:12] something is not right in the culture

[01:14] when we cannot say what we believe, say

[01:16] what we feel, and people cancel us or

[01:19] condemn us or try to get us fired or,

[01:22] you know, whatever it might be. There's

[01:24] a problem with that. And of course we in

[01:27] the Christian community generally

[01:28] believe in all the freedoms of speech

[01:31] that the United States provides us as

[01:34] citizens. But I found that to be

[01:36] refreshing. So that was the kickoff

[01:37] idea. And the film is filled with uh

[01:41] former atheists like Ian Hershey Ali

[01:44] Winston Marshall of course Khloe Cole

[01:47] the dransitioner. And we really we tell

[01:49] their stories uh in the documentary

[01:52] after giving people really a tutorial of

[01:55] western civilization to remind them uh

[01:58] what is different? Why is western

[02:01] civilization different from others? And

[02:03] the key point that is made in the film

[02:05] that really resonated with me is Western

[02:08] civilization was built on one important

[02:12] premise that they recognized that we're

[02:14] made in the image of God and every

[02:17] person deserves respect and that was a

[02:20] breakthrough for humanity. Lifted women,

[02:23] lifted children. It wasn't perfect.

[02:26] There were many things to work out. Yes,

[02:28] slavery and many things, but the whole

[02:29] globe was saturated in slavery and

[02:32] needed to work that out over time. But

[02:35] the point of the the whole film is that

[02:38] the value of people, the value of the

[02:41] individual person was lifted up in

[02:43] Western civilization.

[02:45] >> How do you think we got so far away from

[02:48] that really biblical truth that we were

[02:50] founded on? Because that's not the

[02:52] mentality that we're seeing in culture

[02:54] today.

[02:56] >> Yeah. Well, you know, my corner of work

[02:58] is the family and uh you know, I think

[03:01] from my perspective, some of this is the

[03:03] passing on of values to the next

[03:06] generation. And that in my opinion, that

[03:09] began to become a little less cohesive

[03:13] in the 60s and right on through. We

[03:15] began to lose kind of trust in

[03:17] institutions. You know, maybe for good

[03:19] reason, but I think we may have gone

[03:21] overboard in that regard. And uh ever

[03:25] since the institution of marriage, take

[03:26] that one for example. I had a we did a

[03:29] documentary years ago, irreplaceable, on

[03:31] the importance of the family. And a

[03:33] woman in there, a former feminist from

[03:36] the 60s who was fighting that battle.

[03:38] She said what we were hoping for was

[03:40] acceptance. And through really

[03:44] separating men from the responsibility

[03:46] of pregnancy,

[03:48] >> they she said we ended up with

[03:50] abandonment.

[03:51] >> Think of that statement. We were hoping

[03:53] for acceptance to be equal with men to

[03:55] have autonomy to be in control of our

[03:58] bodies. And what ended up happening is

[04:01] we were abandoned. You know, men just

[04:03] realize we have access to sex without

[04:06] responsibility. And so I'm answering

[04:08] that question from a real traditional

[04:10] perspective. I get that. But when you

[04:13] look at the way things are unraveling, I

[04:15] think it starts with the family, the

[04:17] lack of passing on values to our kids,

[04:19] helping them to understand God's design

[04:22] for human flourishing. You know, one of

[04:24] the things uh we're following this

[04:27] documentary truth rising with another

[04:29] one which is going to be called what is

[04:30] a child? And in that context and Katie

[04:32] Faustst, who's featured in that

[04:34] documentary, is also in truth rising so

[04:37] people can get a glimpse of what she's

[04:38] saying. But her perspective is it used

[04:41] to be adults sacrifice for their

[04:44] children. And in the last 15 years or

[04:46] so, we have flipped that script and now

[04:49] we expect children to sacrifice for

[04:51] adults. In family formation type

[04:53] surrogacy, um you're not going to be

[04:56] connected to your biological parent. Um

[04:59] in in certain situations, you're going

[05:02] to be made in a laboratory implanted.

[05:05] You'll never know your biological father

[05:07] perhaps or your biological mother or

[05:09] perhaps neither of them. And we are so

[05:12] undervaluing the connection to that and

[05:15] what children feel when they're not

[05:17] being raised by their biological mom and

[05:19] dad. Wouldn't it be nice? The I think

[05:22] this the data is in 19 in the 1960s nine

[05:27] out of 10 children were being raised in

[05:29] their biological mom and dad's home.

[05:31] Today it's 40% across the board, but in

[05:34] the black community, for example, it's

[05:36] only like 20%

[05:38] >> or just over 20% have a a father in the

[05:41] home. That has catastrophic

[05:45] consequences to our culture, and I think

[05:47] we're reaping them now.

[05:49] >> Well, there's a lot of problematic

[05:50] messaging geared towards women around my

[05:52] age, and that is your truest self is

[05:56] your best self. So whatever that costs

[05:58] everybody around you, that's what you

[06:00] do. And we see it in Eat, Pray, Love.

[06:02] There's women like Jen Hatmaker and

[06:03] Glennon Doyle Melton who who sprinkle

[06:05] enough scripture in there to where women

[06:08] say, "Oh, okay, that must be biblical.

[06:10] So that means I put myself first,

[06:12] right?" But that is not a biblical

[06:15] message, but that is a very cultural

[06:16] message that women especially are

[06:18] getting.

[06:20] >> It's so true. And you know, it really

[06:22] reinforces our human nature. And you

[06:25] know, I interview a lot of experts on

[06:27] marriage and parenting, but in that

[06:29] marriage space, when you look at the

[06:31] institution of marriage, why did God do

[06:33] this? I mean, my wife Gan and I, we talk

[06:35] about this all the time. Like, she's an

[06:37] introvert. She's got a degree in

[06:39] biochemistry. I'm an extrovert. I was a

[06:41] marketing major. First time we made

[06:43] pancakes was a disaster because I'm just

[06:45] throwing it in and she's going, "No, no,

[06:46] no. One cup is one cup." And taking a

[06:49] knife over the top of the measuring cup,

[06:52] I'm like, "What are you doing? you're

[06:53] freaking me out. The point is humorous,

[06:56] but it also uh goes to the the very

[06:59] institution of marriage uh being an

[07:02] institution God created to take the

[07:05] selfishness out of us so that we could

[07:08] become more like Christ, selfless. And

[07:11] boy, you apply that to the culture

[07:13] today, it's all about me. And I think

[07:16] it's a dangerous place to be. And I

[07:18] think that's one of the reasons you see

[07:19] people who can't tolerate a discussion

[07:22] with opposing viewpoints. Instead, we

[07:25] got to go to violence. I mean, that is

[07:27] not humanity. Everybody, that's a very

[07:30] scary place to go where we can't

[07:32] tolerate hearing an opposing viewpoint.

[07:35] And I have to physically harm you,

[07:36] intimidate you, shout you down because I

[07:40] don't want to hear it. Speech is not

[07:42] hate. Hate is hate. And talking about

[07:46] things is not hate. But you've got to be

[07:47] able to hear people.

[07:49] >> Yeah. And we just saw this on such a

[07:51] horrific scale, of course, with the

[07:52] assassination of Charlie Kirk. How can

[07:56] we understand the message of Truth

[07:57] Rising in light of such horrific

[08:00] violence?

[08:01] >> Well, you know, we're relaunching on X.

[08:04] Uh, we launched it on YouTube and it's

[08:06] free and we're streaming it and we'll be

[08:07] launching on X and we've done a

[08:09] dedication thumbnail at the very

[08:11] beginning of the film to Charlie Kirk

[08:12] because he could have been one of the

[08:15] subjects in the film. Uh, you know,

[08:17] because we're highlighting people both

[08:18] Christian and non-Christian who have

[08:20] raised concerns about the way we're

[08:22] treating one another. And Charlie Kirk,

[08:24] I mean, the timing of Truth Rising is

[08:26] right on the money. It wasn't us. We're

[08:28] not that smart. We're not brilliant

[08:30] people at Focus on the Family. We just

[08:32] got nudged, I believe now, by the Holy

[08:34] Spirit to say, "Okay, do this film." And

[08:36] we do it. And within days of releasing

[08:38] it on YouTube, you know, Charlie Kirk

[08:41] gets killed. And the whole point of the

[08:43] film is for us to recognize the humanity

[08:46] in each other, the great benefits of

[08:48] Western civilization, to recognize those

[08:51] people who um cannot tolerate a

[08:54] dissenting viewpoint and the need to

[08:57] influence them to come back to a place

[08:59] of reasonleness. And the film goes

[09:02] through many victims of religious

[09:03] persecution. Uh like I said, Khloe Cole

[09:06] and Jack Phillips, the baker here in

[09:08] Denver, who's become a very close friend

[09:10] of mine. I also have friendships in the

[09:12] in the LGBTQ community. And I remember

[09:14] at my 60th birthday party, one of those

[09:17] leaders was here at Focus on the Family

[09:19] and Jack Phillips was here in the

[09:20] audience at the same time. I had the

[09:22] privilege of introducing them to each

[09:23] other and the the the the gay leader

[09:26] said to me, "Yeah, it was a mistake

[09:28] picking on Jack. He's such a nice guy.

[09:30] >> Yeah.

[09:31] >> Well, that's the point, right? So, the

[09:34] idea of the film is to help Christians

[09:37] particularly go deeper into their faith.

[09:40] There's a four-part study. It's all

[09:41] free. We're not charging for anything.

[09:44] And in the four-part study, we talk

[09:46] about hope and identity and truth. And

[09:51] uh those are the core things that we

[09:53] want to make people you know one of the

[09:54] I was so touched seeing so many of these

[09:57] interactions with Charlie Kirk and

[09:59] really the last six months I've watched

[10:01] more and more of those interactions

[10:03] because in many ways they were brilliant

[10:05] with Charlie Kirk with people on campus

[10:07] and this 20-year-old woman stepped up to

[10:10] the microphone and just said you know

[10:12] I'm a little intimidated to be here but

[10:14] I've had a gender confusion since I was

[10:17] in third grade. I'm contemplating

[10:19] whether I should do hormone treatment

[10:21] right now at 20 years old. What would

[10:24] you say to me? And Charlie Kirk was so

[10:26] gentle with her and said, "Listen, I'm

[10:29] going to say something to you that I

[10:30] don't think others would say, I would

[10:34] really encourage you before you put

[10:36] chemicals in your body to get with your

[10:39] family, people who love you, talk to

[10:41] somebody who can help on the mental side

[10:43] of what you're experiencing. And I would

[10:46] suggest if you can go that direction,

[10:49] try to find a way to love your body that

[10:52] God's given you, your gender, so you're

[10:54] not at war with your body.

[10:57] >> And I went, "Wow, what a statement."

[11:00] >> And she was very accommodating to that,

[11:02] saying, "I appreciate the feedback." You

[11:05] know, ultimately for us as Christians,

[11:07] we believe that that's where you go to

[11:10] get the deepest healing possible is in a

[11:12] relationship with Jesus Christ. I'm not

[11:14] afraid to say that in part because of

[11:17] the spine that Charlie Kirk showed on

[11:20] these campuses. It's okay to be a

[11:22] Christian. We do have answers to many of

[11:25] humanity's problems.

[11:28] >> What can we make of the response that

[11:30] we've seen to Charlie Kirk's murder?

[11:33] It's been almost jarringly polarizing.

[11:37] Um what can we make of this as believers

[11:40] who condemn evil? We condemn murder.

[11:44] Yeah, I was shocked. I mean, I thought

[11:46] uh you know um there were some responses

[11:50] from the left left center that were

[11:52] appropriate, that were healthy. Jaime

[11:54] Lee Curtis, the actress who said, "I

[11:57] don't agree with Charlie Kirk." But she

[12:00] choked up and began to cry about this

[12:02] young man who's married with two young

[12:04] children

[12:05] >> and being assassinated. And you know,

[12:07] you could tell it really got to her even

[12:11] though she couldn't dis she couldn't

[12:12] agree with Charlie Kirk. That to me is a

[12:14] healthy human being. That's a person who

[12:16] can respond. Um, so I think when I look

[12:19] at that response, I think the irony is

[12:21] the people that want to harm people who

[12:25] are saying things that they disagree

[12:27] with. In Charlie Kirk's case, they may

[12:29] have lit a brush, a a fire

[12:32] >> that is going to, I think, for a while,

[12:35] change this country in very good ways

[12:37] from a Christian perspective. People are

[12:40] motivated. People are not remaining

[12:42] silent and letting uh those people who

[12:46] are violent and disagree to continue to

[12:50] behave in a way that is inhumane

[12:54] uh toward the conservative, toward the

[12:56] Christian community. And I could only

[12:57] hope and I pray as a Christian that we

[12:59] don't respond in a nasty way and that

[13:03] brings our message down to the gutter

[13:05] and we don't want to play in that arena.

[13:07] The Lord's very specific about being

[13:10] patient with evildoers to be kind toward

[13:13] all people to uh make sure your speech

[13:17] is um gentle and generous. We need to

[13:21] maintain the fruit of the spirit. Love,

[13:22] joy, peace, goodness, mercy. That's who

[13:25] we are as Christians. And I just hope it

[13:28] doesn't tip any Christians toward

[13:30] violence, which is potential.

[13:34] >> Scripture warns us that believers will

[13:36] face trials and persecution for

[13:38] following Christ. How does truth rising

[13:41] help prepare Christians for this reality

[13:44] while also reminding us of the hope

[13:46] that's going to come with the

[13:47] resurrection?

[13:48] >> That's a great question. I think one is

[13:50] just knowledge. You know, one of the

[13:52] things we want to encourage people to do

[13:53] is read the word. You know, sometimes

[13:56] we're illiterate as Christians. We don't

[13:58] understand the arguments. Another

[13:59] brilliant thing with Charlie Kirk, he

[14:01] knew the word. He understood how to

[14:03] apply it in arguments and discussions

[14:05] and how to ask questions that brought

[14:07] people along on the issues of abortion

[14:10] or uh transgendered students that he

[14:13] would engage. And I I think in that

[14:14] regard, I think Truth Rising, one, the

[14:18] first half of the film is really a

[14:20] college level course in Western

[14:22] civilization. I don't think enough of us

[14:24] know how to defend the good things that

[14:26] the West has done to lift people out of

[14:29] poverty, to lift people physically,

[14:32] medically, uh you know, the wonderful

[14:34] achievements that the West has gained.

[14:37] And uh really when you talk to people

[14:38] that like um Ian Hersy Ali, you know,

[14:42] she grew up in Somalia. She grew up in a

[14:44] place where women were not respected

[14:47] highly and she had an arranged marriage

[14:49] and she didn't want to do it and she

[14:51] left home at 18 and then moved to the

[14:54] Netherlands, became a representative

[14:56] there. her a friend of hers did a film

[14:59] about her story and he was murdered and

[15:02] stabbed through the heart with a note on

[15:04] his on his chest saying we're coming

[15:07] after you meaning I and Hershey Ali

[15:11] >> and so do we have enough of that

[15:14] capacity? Are we mature enough as

[15:17] Christians to understand the moment

[15:18] we're in? Did I think Charlie Kirk

[15:21] understood that he could be killed. I

[15:23] think he knew that because of the

[15:25] dangerous environments he was placing

[15:28] himself in. Did it change his

[15:30] willingness to do it? Not at all. Even

[15:33] knowing the threat, he went out and and

[15:36] spoke boldly about truth and about

[15:39] scripture, what scripture has to say

[15:41] about humanity and human flourishing. I

[15:44] think I think truth rising is trying to

[15:48] support that kind of spine, develop that

[15:51] kind of goodness. It doesn't have to be

[15:53] harsh. My goodness, don't get in the

[15:54] arena if you're mean-spirited and trying

[15:57] to simply win. Please stay on the

[15:59] sidelines. But if you're willing to

[16:02] learn and willing to ask questions and

[16:04] willing to empathize with people who are

[16:07] hurting, who does that sound like, by

[16:08] the way? Oh, Jesus.

[16:10] >> Yeah.

[16:10] >> And then be able to speak truth to those

[16:12] people. I think, you know, I think

[16:14] that's the gain. And that's, you know,

[16:15] if more people became Christian from my

[16:18] perspective, that's a wonderful thing.

[16:21] What encouragement would you offer to

[16:22] believers who are discouraged by the

[16:24] cultural moment and they're not sure of

[16:27] their ability to make a difference

[16:29] because it is a scary climate we're in

[16:31] right now.

[16:32] >> I think the intimidation factor one it

[16:35] it's self-imposed to some degree because

[16:37] we think who am I? I'm you know I'm the

[16:39] electrician. I'm I'm a baker. What what

[16:41] can I do? But the film Truth Rising will

[16:44] encourage you to really just be a light

[16:47] in your community. You don't have to be

[16:49] a national figure. Uh that's not the

[16:51] point. The point is to do good in your

[16:54] community. You know, the this idea that

[16:57] we have about God's peace. You know,

[16:59] it's known as shalom. God's shalom. Uh

[17:03] we do a series that the world may know

[17:05] with Ray Vanderlon who is a Jewish

[17:08] scholar. And his point there is when sin

[17:10] entered the world, right back to the

[17:12] garden, Adam and Eve, when sin entered

[17:14] the world, chaos entered the world. And

[17:17] you could look around at different areas

[17:19] of the culture. Foster care, I was a

[17:21] foster kid. My wife and I became foster

[17:24] parents for like 10 years. I would say

[17:26] there's no greater area of chaos than

[17:28] foster care.

[17:29] >> These kids are just emotionally beaten,

[17:32] sometimes physically beaten, and they

[17:34] come to your home with all kinds of

[17:37] problems. Headbanging, food hoarding,

[17:40] gender dysphoria. The list just keeps

[17:42] going. There's no box that you check in

[17:44] foster care that says normal

[17:47] >> because kids just bear the brunt of

[17:49] brokenness in the family.

[17:51] >> And uh you can get involved in that way.

[17:55] You might want to get involved in doing

[17:56] foster or wrapping around a family that

[18:00] does foster. So in that way you do

[18:02] something good. And believe me when you

[18:04] do those things it helps you feel joy

[18:07] because you're giving back to others.

[18:09] And I think the Lord knows that. He

[18:10] wired it in our DNA. When it comes to

[18:13] fear, the Lord himself said, "Fear not."

[18:15] You know, they hate you because they

[18:18] hate me.

[18:19] >> And when you're talking about me and my

[18:22] way and the Christian life and what it

[18:24] means to be dedicated to the Lord, not

[18:26] in a nasty way, in a kind way, a loving

[18:29] way, but a truthful way, you're going to

[18:32] get push back. People won't like you.

[18:35] And uh I think in that regard, we just

[18:37] need to uh buckle up, trust the Lord. I

[18:40] would much rather be standing as Charlie

[18:42] Kirk did last week. He's in this life

[18:44] one minute and he's before the Lord the

[18:46] next to say, 'Lord, I attempted to let

[18:50] people know of who you are and how much

[18:52] you love them and how much you want for

[18:55] them. And I I I just can't imagine a God

[18:58] saying, "You were too rough." Um I just

[19:01] think the Lord will say, "Did you love

[19:03] others?" Because those are the two great

[19:05] commandments. Love the Lord your God

[19:06] with all your heart, soul, and strength,

[19:08] and love your neighbor as yourself.

[19:11] It doesn't say you have to agree with

[19:12] others. Love your neighbor. And I think

[19:15] if we apply those things, the world's

[19:17] going to be changed. Our city has

[19:19] changed. Our state is changed.