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Lila Rose Debates 25 Pro-Choice Activists on Abortion Rights, Bodily Autonomy, and the Right to Life
Lila Rose, President and founder of Live Action, faces 25 pro-choice activists in an intense debate covering abortion regret, exceptions for rape and incest, bodily autonomy, and when life begins. Rose argues that abortion leaves women scarred, cannot be justified under any circumstance, and that every unborn child has a right to life. Pro-choice participants challenge her with personal stories of abortion, cases of rape survivors, medical emergencies, and arguments about consciousness and personhood. The debate explores the tension between fetal rights and women's bodily autonomy, the definition of human life, and whether abortion is healthcare or the taking of innocent life.
Introduction: One Woman Against 25 Pro-Choice Voices
Lila Rose, President and founder of Live Action, mother of three, and host of The Lila Rose podcast, entered a room surrounded by 25 pro-choice activists ready to challenge her fundamental beliefs about abortion. What followed was an intense, emotional, and deeply personal debate that covered everything from abortion regret and bodily autonomy to medical exceptions and the definition of personhood. Rose's mission was clear: to defend three central claims that form the foundation of the pro-life movement.
First Claim: Abortion Leaves Women Scarred for Life
Rose opened with her first claim: abortion leaves women scarred for life. She argued that the word "scar" means permanent, and while life is permanent, so is death. She shared that she has personally spoken with hundreds of women who struggle deeply with abortion regret, particularly on the anniversary of when their baby would have been born.
"For many women, on the anniversary of when that baby would have been born—one, two, three, four years old—there's deep regret and pain," Rose explained. She cited studies showing that women who have abortions have higher rates of suicidality than women who give birth, referencing a California study of 200,000 Medicaid patients showing women were 150% more likely to commit suicide if they had an abortion versus giving birth.
Pro-choice participants pushed back immediately. Julia argued that by not allowing women abortion access, society forces them to have "a permanent being that exists in this world." She also raised concerns about Rose's undercover work at Planned Parenthood, saying she would feel unsafe if someone went undercover to "mask something."
Rose defended her investigative journalism, explaining that women deserve to know the truth about abortion providers. She emphasized that abortion is not an easy choice for women, but questioned why it carries such weight if it's simply healthcare like removing a wisdom tooth.
Other participants shared personal stories. Demi argued that the emotional scarring comes not from abortion itself but from the shame inflicted by pro-life activists protesting outside clinics. India, a young Black woman who had an abortion before her 21st birthday, challenged Rose directly: "You have absolutely no idea what people go through... God is the only one that can actually judge me."
Rose acknowledged that not all women experience immediate regret, but maintained that many women's stories of abortion regret aren't being told by mainstream media. She argued that the pro-abortion narrative leaves no space for women to share their regret without being told they're "feeding into a harmful narrative."
Personal Stories of Abortion: No Regret Versus Deep Pain
The debate became intensely personal when multiple participants shared their abortion experiences. Jax, who identified as a survivor of domestic violence, drug addiction, and sex work, confronted Rose about presuming to know how her child would feel.
"You're telling me how my child would feel and what gives you the right?" Jax demanded. "I was in a domestic violence shelter. I've got a dog I can barely take care of. You're expecting me to sit here and let you tell me how I'm supposed to feel."
Rose responded with empathy but maintained her position: "I think you're amazing. I think if that's what you've overcome in your life, I think that's incredible and you should be proud of overcoming so many tough things in your life. It does break my heart that if you're sharing you had an abortion, that there could be a child—I don't know how old they'd be, 10 years old today—who would be cheering you on saying 'go get him, Mom, you got this.'"
"I can promise you that would not be the case," Jax shot back. "You don't get to speak for my child. You don't get to speak for my child, let's start right there."
India shared that she considered adoption but had grown up in foster care and witnessed babies with drug withdrawals and children from rape victims. "I've seen all of it," she said. "It's not the best environment I would want to raise a child in." She emphasized that her decision wasn't about killing a baby but about choosing what to do with her own body.
Rose acknowledged these difficult circumstances but argued that women deserve better support systems rather than abortion as the solution. She maintained that adoption provides an alternative, noting that two million families want to adopt newborns but can't because of the million abortions performed annually in America.
Medical Exceptions: High-Risk Pregnancies and Fetal Abnormalities
The conversation shifted to medical exceptions when participants raised cases of high-risk pregnancies. Miriam shared her best friend's mother's story—a woman told she had to have a late-term abortion because her child would not live more than one hour, and if she gave birth, she would never be able to have children again.
Rose challenged this narrative, citing Dr. Anthony Levatino, who worked with tens of thousands of high-risk pregnancies in upstate New York. "He said in the number of pregnancies where we had to do an abortion was zero," Rose stated. "Sometimes we would have to do an early delivery, but we would never have to intentionally kill the baby to deal with the health risk for the mother."
She argued that what women deserve in these cases is better medical care—an early delivery that attempts to save both mother and baby, rather than an abortion that intentionally kills the child.
Alex shared the story of Anya Cook from Florida, who at 16 weeks had her water break. Despite the pregnancy being non-viable, the emergency room turned her away because performing the procedure would count as an abortion under Florida's 15-week ban. Ana went home with her stillborn baby inside her, eventually delivering in a hair salon bathroom and nearly bleeding to death.
Rose responded that if the baby was already dead, turning the woman away was medical malpractice. "If the baby has passed away, it's completely legal in any pro-life state to complete a miscarriage," she explained. However, Alex clarified that the baby was still alive when Ana's water broke—the pregnancy was doomed, but the fetus hadn't yet died.
This highlighted a key tension in abortion restrictions: the difficulty of creating clear legal lines when medical situations are complex and individualized.
Rape, Incest, and the Question of Exceptions
The debate became most heated when discussing exceptions for rape and incest. Dana, executive director of one of the nation's oldest rape crisis centers, confronted Rose directly.
"Abortion care is healthcare for survivors and it gives them the options that they need in order to move forward after they have had so many choices taken away from them," Dana stated. "One in 20 women who have had pregnancies have had pregnancies that result from assault. So you cannot tell me that there is no circumstance where I don't make that choice for my body."
Rose acknowledged the horror of sexual assault but maintained her position: "Two wrongs don't make a right. If there's a horrific act of assault, a rape, and a pregnancy results, that new life is conceived—ending that new life, giving that new human being the death penalty for the crime of their father, I don't believe that's justified."
She referenced her friends Rebecca Kiessling and Ryan Bomberger, both conceived in brutal rapes. "They go around and they say, 'I was that embryo, I was that fetus, I was that unborn baby. Do I not have a right to live? Should I have gotten the death penalty for the crime of my father?'"
Dana pushed back: "That mother made a choice. I as a person who has been assaulted get to make that choice for my body. I didn't get to make that choice with that rape, but I do get to make the choice with what happens with that fertilized egg."
The exchange became more intense when the case of a 10-year-old rape victim came up. Mason challenged Rose: "That 10-year-old in Ohio who was raped by her father, then was told she couldn't have an abortion, had to go to a different state. You're more than comfortable with holding down a 10-year-old once again to make her do something with her body she doesn't want to do?"
Rose maintained that abortion is another act of violence both to the baby and to the survivor. "In a case of a very young girl who's been the victim of a horrific assault, there are human rights now in play for an unborn child and a born child. They both have rights," she argued, suggesting that an early delivery would be necessary to protect the girl's health while giving the baby a chance to live.
Mason countered with emotion: "Which child are you worried about punishing? The 10-year-old who was already punished?" The participant argued that Rose was affording more empathy toward a zygote than a living, breathing 10-year-old who just went through serious trauma.
Second Claim: Abortion Cannot Be Justified Under Any Circumstance
Rose's second claim—that abortion cannot be justified under any circumstance—drew intense opposition. Mason attempted an analogy about gun rights, arguing that just as conservatives say guns are a necessary evil that will exist whether legal or not, abortion will also happen whether it's legal or not, and it's better for it to be safe.
Rose rejected the comparison and returned to her central question: "Do you think that it is always wrong to kill an innocent person?"
Mason responded that while intentional killing of innocents should be opposed, "the rights of people's bodily autonomy is something that supersedes the preservation of life, especially when it comes to government enforcement."
This led to a discussion about dependency. Rose challenged whether dependency on a mother's body gives her the right to end the child's life. Mason argued that a toddler can be cared for by anyone, but a fetus requires the specific biological functions of that particular mother.
Rose countered: "The womb is designed for a baby, right?" When Mason hesitated, Rose pressed: "What else are wombs designed for?" The exchange ended without resolution on this fundamental disagreement about bodily autonomy versus fetal rights.
Bodily Autonomy Versus Right to Life
The question of bodily autonomy dominated much of the debate. Whitney, a mother, argued passionately that calling an embryo or fetus an "unborn child" is disingenuous. "I don't know how a child would fit in my uterus, it doesn't even really make sense," she said.
Whitney shared her own experience of being questioned in an emergency room about what she had done to cause a possible miscarriage when her state was working to pass a six-week abortion ban. "My bodily autonomy is paramount, is the most important thing," she insisted. "To say women's bodily autonomy should be sacrificed for a hypothetical baby, a hypothetical child—because a pregnancy that is not a child, it's a fetus, it's an embryo."
Rose challenged this framing: "Your argument is that bodily autonomy, your bodily autonomy, is more important than the unborn child's right to life?"
"No one has the right to use my body or organs without my consent," Whitney responded. She posed a hypothetical: "If my five-year-old son needs a kidney or he will die, if I don't give him my kidney, is that killing him?"
Rose distinguished between action and inaction: "An abortion is the intentional killing of that child." She explained the various abortion procedures—poisoning via abortion pill, suction in first trimester, live dismemberment in second trimester, or lethal injection in third trimester.
This fundamental tension—whether refusing to provide one's body is the same as actively killing—remained unresolved throughout the debate.
Third Claim: Every Unborn Child Has the Right to Life
Rose's third claim centered on when personhood and rights begin. Adam challenged her use of the word "child," arguing that personhood begins around 22 weeks of gestation when the thalamus connects to the cortex and the brain can support subjective experience.
"Why do you think that a fetus at 10 weeks, 8 weeks, that has no capacity to be self-aware, to experience pain or anything else, should be valued equal to the bodily autonomy of a woman?" Adam asked.
Rose established that Adam agreed a human fetus is human, then argued: "Every human has a human right to life." She challenged his consciousness-based definition by asking about people who are unconscious—are they no longer human?
Adam clarified that even people under anesthesia or in comas still have neural pathways connecting the thalamus and cortex. But Rose pressed further: What about people born with severe brain development disorders who lack these specific connections?
Adam argued there's no conflict between respecting someone born with anencephaly and abortion rights, because that person's existence doesn't impede anyone's bodily autonomy. "The reason it's okay to terminate a fetus prior to 22 weeks is not because of the fetus itself, it's because it's the only way to resolve the conflict between the bodily autonomy of the woman and the fetus."
Rose maintained her position that if someone is human, they have human rights regardless of brain development. She argued that dependency doesn't eliminate rights: "My bodily autonomy ends when another human being's bodily autonomy begins."
The Science of Personhood and Consciousness
Brianna engaged Rose in a detailed discussion about definitions. When Rose defined an unborn child as "a member of the human species that is not born yet," Brianna asked what characteristics distinguish humans from other living organisms.
Rose pointed to the human genetic code and natural capacity for reason, conscious experience, choice, and love. Brianna pushed back: "So you're saying that consciousness is what defines us as a human being, having awareness and a conscious experience?"
Rose clarified: "Human beings have the natural capacity for reason, but they don't all have the active capacity. A newborn baby doesn't have an active capacity for language, for reasoning, for making arguments that maybe an adult would."
Brianna challenged this with an analogy: "Are blueprints the same as a building?" She argued that DNA is a blueprint, but the unborn baby in early stages is just the building blocks, not yet the completed structure.
Rose rejected the analogy: "The unborn baby is not a blueprint. Your DNA is a blueprint, but the unborn baby is also made of cells which are themselves alive and developing."
The debate was cut short before reaching resolution, but it highlighted a central philosophical question: Is potential for consciousness the same as actual consciousness? And should moral consideration be based on current capacities or natural capacities that will develop?
Evan's Challenge: The Frozen Embryo Question
In the final exchange shown, Evan posed a challenging hypothetical designed to test the consistency of Rose's position. He asked whether she would prefer a world where someone shot and killed a born human baby, or a world where someone destroyed a tray full of frozen zygotes.
This question gets at whether pro-life advocates truly believe a single-cell embryo has equal moral worth to a born child. The debate ended before Rose could fully respond, leaving this profound question hanging in the air.
Common Themes and Unresolved Tensions
Throughout the debate, several themes emerged repeatedly. Pro-choice participants emphasized bodily autonomy, the diversity of women's experiences, and the impossibility of creating clear legal lines for complex medical situations. They argued that forcing women to continue pregnancies, especially in cases of rape or medical complications, constitutes a violation of fundamental rights.
Rose consistently returned to what she sees as the humanity of the unborn child and the principle that all human beings have equal rights regardless of their stage of development, level of consciousness, or circumstances of conception. She argued that abortion is not healthcare but the intentional killing of innocent human life.
The debate also highlighted the role of shame and stigma. Some participants argued that abortion regret is caused not by the abortion itself but by pro-life protesters and societal judgment. Rose countered that society's pro-abortion narrative leaves no space for women to express regret without being told they're harming the cause.
Neither side appeared to change their fundamental positions, but the exchange revealed the deep moral, philosophical, and practical questions at the heart of the abortion debate—questions about when life begins, what constitutes personhood, whether bodily autonomy can be absolute, and how to balance competing rights when they appear to conflict.
Video Transcript
it does break my heart that if you're sharing you had an abortion that there could be a child I don't know how old they be 10 years old today who would be cheering you on saying go get a mom you got this I can promise you that would not be the case with your statistic and your information had a right to live you don't get to speak for my child you don't get to speak for my child let's start right there hey everybody I'm lla Rose I am the President and founder of live action I am a mom of three a wife and the host of The lla Rose podcast and today I'm surrounded by 25 Pro Choice [Music] activist my first claim is abortion leaves women scarred for [Music] life hey hello what's your name Julia Julia nice to meet you nice to meet you okay so from my understanding is scar means permanent and I would argue that life is permanent and so by not allowing women to an abortion you're basically saying you have to have this permanent being that exists in this world death is also permanent and that's what a lot of women struggle with especially on the anniversary of when that baby would have been born for many women again I've talk I've talked to hundreds just personally but there are thousands and millions more out there on the anniversary of when that baby would have been born 1 2 3 four years old there's deep regret and pain and some struggle with mental illness afterwards or other struggles or they have fertility issues there have been several studies done that show that women have higher suicidality who have abortions than that women that give birth there's a California study which is 200,000 Medicaid patients 150% more likely to commit suicide if they had had an abortion than if they had given birth right so I think do you about that so I have a lot I have a lot of that I also want to talk about the fact that for my understanding is you did go undercover into Planned Parenthood and I have many friends that work Parenthood which honestly i' I'd feel a little unsafe if someone was like going undercover to mask something the thing Isen oh hold on hold on a minute I think women abortion is not an easy choice for women I don't go oh you know what what do I want to do today so go see a movie or um have Antion not an easy Choice why is abortion not an easy choice for it's not easy choice for any woman why because you are literally deciding your own future on your own terms and we're allowing women the choice and why is that why is that decision so so heavy for example I could go decision I could go in and get a wisdom tooth removed and I'm not going to an elective Choice like I'm not going to have this heavy decision around it why is abortion such a uniquely heavy decision why are women the only ones having to choose and War shamed instead of men because men who are committing acts of assault let's see I don't think their father of the year quite frankly if they're committing acts of violence women in toal agreement on we're in total agreement that okay you're a mother how many adopted children do you have I don't have any adopted children okay so what about all the children okay so great let's call the agency tomorrow it'll take a couple years to go through the adoption process into the systems them and women there are 2 million families who would like to adopt a newborn baby and they can't okay are you helping them cuz if you're providing resources we do promote and help that but you know you know the reason why they can't adopt the reason they're not able to adopt is because we have a million abortions a year our country kills children if were abortions I would say that a scarring exists those are allal abortions to be clear those a million abortions a year are all being are you not going to feel Catholic guilt when all the women are dying in parking lots from illegal abortions so I people women are dying right now from legal abortions women who take the abortion pill 30,000 of them are going into the emergency room every year because of the abortion the legal abortion are now in fear of media is lying to you guys the media is lying to you guys because legal abortion kills women it killed Tanya Reeves in a Chicago Planned Parenthood I have a lot of friends about abortions they're Liv I was talking to them yesterday they're pretty they're pretty chill they're actually pretty they're in therapy because they made that choice of children when they are ready to have children there tens of thousands of women who go to emergency rooms because of the abortion pill there are dozens of women who die fromal AB access in education sex education early on and legal abortions that well men and women would have access to education to understand sex you've been voted out by the majority please return thank you nice to meet [Music] [Applause] you hi what's your name Demi Demi nice to meet you um so I just want to like clear it up when you say scarring for life like what do you mean I mean it leaves at minimum emotional wounds on many women and some of them physical wounds I think something to like focus on is like the emotional part it's the shame that you get from pro-life activists I know what it's like to go to plann Parenthood and walk out and then see people protesting calling the women murderers chanting religious prayers at them I think that's what's the scarring part emotionally so I've had the privilege of interviewing now almost a thousand women who've had abortions and hearing their stories and many of them share about how everyone told them it was the right thing to do that no one had there was nobody opposing it and they had the abortion but you run a pro life and years later and this is their story and then years later they would say focusing on people well this is their story not mine and they would tell me and they would report about how after their abortion sometimes it would be years later they would remember it and they would say what about other done that who don't regret or they would face mental health challenges they'd face addiction what the people who don't some of them would face infertility you're not interviewing the people who don't regret it who think that their life would have been worse off if they didn't get the abortion so I think if if what you're saying is there's some women who don't regret it I think it's absolutely true there are some women who would maybe sit right here and say had an abortion I don't regret it at all it was great but I that doesn't mean that abortion isn't leaving women scarred for life because it is but those stories usually aren those stories aren't usually made or told by typical media groups usually in media and in the entertainment world you hear the stories of the women that are saying abortion is great it empowers me there are thousands and thousands of women who experience bitter abortion regret and there's also women can have abortions and they want to have kids in the future but they know that they're not in the position for it right then and now so they can have guilt they can feel sorry but that's not all women and that's totally I think there's a stigma today if I may I think there's a stigma today on a lot of women that they can't share their abortion regret because Society is telling them that abortion is your right it's empowering it's a reproductive freedom and so if you have abortion reget there's not really space to share that s you're feeding into the harmful narrative what harmful narrative that women are getting abortions and then that they shouldn't feel regret about it because they're murderers and then they should own up to their actions that's what the pro-life people are arguing I I think what our our Narrative of you want to call it that is to say this is a human life the science tells us this it's always wrong to take a human life and abortion does leave deep scars on a lot of women thank [Music] you what's your name hi nice to meet you my name's India India nice to meet you okay so when you say that abortion leaves women scarred for life I have had an abortion before I had an abortion actually a week before my 21st birthday I'm a young black woman in America come from a low-income family I'm also adopted how do you feel about your abortion how do I feel about my abortion that's what I'm about to tell you so um I wouldn't want to have to make the decisions of what's next after a child is born I personally did not feel like I was in the proper mental State Financial State emotional state physical state I did not feel like I was in the best of any of those states to be able to Bear a child to be a parent exactly my circumstance was a little bit different with the father would have been child he actually wanted me to keep the child but I chose not to because of my body did you I'm curious if you considered adoption I absolutely did but like I said based on my testimony and what I've experienced I grew up in a home with foster children in and out I have an adopted brother as well we're two years apart um during my foster stay at my home which is now my lifelong home that I've been at I've seen all different kinds of circumstances I've seen babies having withdrawals I've seen babies who come from rape victims I've seen all of it I've seen all of it you name it it's not the best environment I in my opinion that I would want to raise a child in okay I have friends who have multiple children and they're struggling because they don't have the resources that they need they don't have the proper support system that they need the whole thing about this pro-life and pro-choice it's not I'm choosing to kill this baby pro-choice is the choice of what I want to do with my body not what you think I should do with my body wait I'm not done yet so um anyways what I want to do with my body who are you to judge me I go to church I I'm actually a new member of the church which which is which is funny I didn't believe in God a couple years ago that's great that you're going to church thank you and you know the decision that I made maybe wasn't the thing that I 100% wanted to do it was defitely you mean did you feel pressured to have the abortion no absolutely not because everybody around me was in support of whatever I did especially my mother and especially the father of the child but I didn't feel pressured at all in fact I felt as if it was harder to make the decision based on how I'm going to feel exactly and as you're saying women are scarred from this I don't feel scarred I definitely have an effect from it but I don't think that saying this procedure scars women for life because you don't know what I'm going through up here absolutely not I don't care who you are what you stand for what organization you're behind respond to judge me I'd love to respond the flags are going up and I'd love to respond um but you know like I'm my whole point is you have absolutely no idea what people go through so I understand you're experiencing and you're telling me your experience which is important everybody's experience is important absolutely the lot of the women that I've had the privilege of talking to their abortion wasn't yesterday their abortion was a couple years ago 5 years ago 10 years ago as you get older you get more established in your life you're a young woman I'm not saying that that's not going to me later down the line but what I am saying well that's that's the key right cuz we make big decisions right especially when we're young we can make big decisions they have an effect down the line and so my advocacy is to saying this is a big decision this is a human but is it your right to make the decision for me or to say what decision is right because God is the only one that can actually judge me and based on my belief he's the only one to tell you it's not my right to tell you what to do with your personal life but it is the government's responsibility protect right to you're saying do you want the government to protect you from being killed you know I want I want God to protect me from everything evil in this world absolutely the end of the day I can't guarantee that I can't guarantee that I'm not going to walk out this door and get shot in the head but do you think if you think that if somebody tries to do that you would hope someone would intervene honestly I'm just going to pray for the best well I would hope someone would intervene and I want to live in a country where there would be a penalty if you really wanted somebody to intervene with the protection of life you would be kind you know getting more background on these on these women and why they do the things that they do well I think I yeah thank you nice to meet [Applause] you hi hi what's your name Audrey Audrey nice to meet you okay so do you know the number one emotion um PE women get after having an abortion is relief are you are you referring to the turnaway study with that information okay so the turnaway study has been debunked because it's done by those that support abortion and they said they were going to follow a thousand women to see if there was an abortion regret after their abortions only 150 women would complete the study with them the rest of them dropped off some of them struggling with issues maybe connected to that abortion but only 150 completed it so that's a survey of only 150 women and again I think we need to look at women at large and their experiences and there will be some women who say well I feel great I'm good this is good I don't regret it and then there's a lot of women whose stories aren't aren't being told but you don't look at women at large their experiences that's what that's what we do and those women deeply regret their abortions they feel scarred by their abortions some of them suffer mental health issues afterwards that's not true at all 95% of people who got abortions said it was the right decision refering the turnaway study which is you could search that up I think it's better to look at a study like the Medicaid study in California 200,000 women not 150 women doing a study with a pro abortion group it was a California 200,000 survey of women of those that had abortions they were 150% more likely to commit suicide than those that gave birth and did not have abortions in Finland there were two studies done of women there that found that women who had abortions who had a higher likelihood of committing suicide than women who did not have abortions people deserve to know this women deserve to know this because when they have an abortion that's a huge life-altering decision not just for ending the life of a baby but it's life altering for the woman it is life-altering for the woman cuz you know pregnancy is a big deal having a baby having a baby is very very expensive and if you're willing to put survivors children on top of that and the shame that they have to go through forcing an 11-year-old to go through a pregnancy and yes they're not forced to be a parent but the adoptive and Foster Care Systems are very very my friend lyanna rebelo she was brutally in a gang by age 12 she went to the doctor she found out she was pregnant she had severe mental health issues suicidality from the trauma of the right she goes to the doctor the doctor says you're pregnant and the doctor says says do you want an abortion and she says will the abortion take away the trauma of that the the the horror IDE my body choice though but that's her doctor said let me just finish what she said and the doctor said no it will not he was honest with her and she said why would I take the life of this baby because of the trauma not everybody not everybody will it's a belief but it's also a fact that it was a human being inside her it was an innocent third party because of that perpetrated upon her thank you nice to meet [Applause] [Music] you hi what's her name Jax Prince nice to meet you ja nice to meet you Mil So based off you've given incredible points genuinely and truly I'm learning quite a bit thank you so for the people that you say have the abortion young how old do I look out of curiosity hm you're never supposed to answer that right no go ahead by means will you tell me you'll do me if I do you yeah okay all right you are 25 I appreciate that at about 10 more years so by your thank you you look amazing by your logic I should be in that age range of people who abort let's say you know who who should be feeling the regret and everything if I had carried a term I would be labeled a drug addicted black mother and if I had kept the baby I would have been labeled a incompetent single mother so my question for you is what is your perception of how I should feel about my my abortion so a couple things first of all sometimes the regret happens later in life it's not within even 5 or 10 years the trauma they feel might come out later when they have their own other children or grandchildren so every woman it's going to be different sometimes it's immediate sometimes it takes years I mean I think I think you're amazing I think if that's what you've overcome in your life I think that's incredible and you should be proud of overcoming so many tough things in your life it does break my heart that if you're sharing you had an abortion that there could be a child I don't know how old they be 10 years old today who would be cheering you on saying go get him Mom you got this I can promise you that would not be the case because I can almost promise you that would not be the case because I say again I'm in a domestic violence shelter I've got a dog I can barely take care of You're Expecting excuse me you're expecting me to sit here and let you tell me how I'm supposed to feel you're trying to scare me I'm not tell you how yes you are yes you are with your statistics tell you that your your statistics and your information with your statistic and your information right you are completely wrong because yes and I wish someone had been helping you more listen but you everybody always likees to say oh keep the baby give it up for adoption I know what our foster care system is like you can't tell me I would have a child cheering me on a child ad hold on you're not going you don't get to speak for my child you don't get to speak for my child let's start right there you don't get to speak for my child saying oh Mommy would be cheering you on everything like that you don't know that you don't know that at all you don't know what my child would be I may not even have my child because I was so unfit at the time drug addiction sex work everything like that yes well I'm a proud proo that is exactly what I do but you're telling me how my child would feel and what gives you the right what gives you the right what gives you the right I would love to respond to you I would love to respond to you I think yes your your child had a right to life and I would say that there are I wish there were more people helping you at the time it sounds like you were in a really rough time in your life and I think that you mattered that baby mattered and you both deserve more help that's what I would say that's what you would say but you're saying my child be cheering me on right now you would hope you would hope so all of this is going off of Hope please return to your [Music] [Applause] seat hello what's your name miam miam nice to meet you nice to meet you so I just want to start off and your say that a lot of women have abortion regret right so I'm going to tell you about what happened to my best friend's mom she had a late term abortion which I know you don't find morally acceptable but her far was she I'm not sure sure the exact week but she was told that her child would not live for more than one hour however if she gave birth to that child she would never be able to have children again that is literally what they told her I'm so glad that she was able to get an abortion because my best friend would wouldn't be alive if her mother wasn't able to have an abortion before she was even born so I just like yeah there are some women who regret abortions but we shouldn't just ban all abortions because of some of those women regretting it there are many women I love one I've heard so many stories of medical professionals who tell the woman you have to have an abortion X Y and Z is their opinion right and then I talk tog and I talked to many other medicalal if I can finish I talk to many other medical professionals who say if you have a high-risk pregnancy or there's a disability that the baby has there is healthc care for you to protect both your life and the baby's life that's what women deserve they don't deserve to be told by the abortionist or the the doctor just kill this baby that's the solution have the abortion so we can do better for both the mom and the baby Dr Anthony just just as an example Dr Anthony levatino he worked with tens of thousands of high-risk pregnancies in Upper state New York dealing with these very highrisk pregnancies he said in the in the number of pregnancies where we had to do an abortion was Zero some times we would have to do an early delivery but we would never have to kill intentionally kill the baby to deal with the health risk for the mother necessary right so correct and so as an example your friend right you said she had a late term abortion because her baby had a health issue and was going to die and then otherwise she would have an issue the doctor and my you know Dr Anthony Latino as an example could have done an early delivery to give that baby a chance at life instead of intentionally killing that baby in I don't understand sit here across the table thousand of professional fight for both the life of the baby and mother can't tell me what my best friend's mother could have had done to her you she deserved better medical care she deserved better Medical Care than was told was unfair and wrong what she was told she wasn't given a choice she was given a choice they told her you're going to die they told her you you have to have this abortion that's what they told informing her medic she canot deliver children if she had not had that abortion so why do you think that she just to be clear in a late term abortion you have to remove the baby right yes and what is the difference between a late term abortion where you remove the baby dead and an early delivery where you can remove the Baby Alive one is an abortion and one is a life-saving act what she deserved was a life-saving act for both her and that baby and an early delivery could have been what she need I agree because she wanted that child however that's why it's devastating that they told her that it's wrong they told her that no but they were right no how how how can you say that when there are of medical there's thousands of medical professionals who say that abortion is not medically necessary not my opinion it's thousands medical uh professionals who say that that's time I appreciate that but you're not a doctor and you weren't her doctor there's thousands of medical professionals who say you can care for both mother and baby that's fine but it's you can doctors be wrong doctors can be wrong can you be wrong could our doctor have been wrong my next claim is abortion cannot be justified under any [Music] circumstance hi good to meet you lla nice to meet to meet you what was your name Mason Mason nice to meet you so a couple things first uh correct me if I'm wrong I'm going to make a lot of assumptions about your organization I don't know the specifics but when you say alternatives to abortion I assume that you're saying philanthropic U assistance when it comes to helping people with pregnancy or start families is that true yeah promoting options that are not killing the baby basically so that could be adopting the baby and I think that's valuable to a lot of people especially if they don't have the economic means in order to start a family so I want to commend you on that when it comes to the policy proposals that you propagate as an organization I would say that those don't help anybody especially when it comes to just adding punitive measures familiar with our policy proposals because we we support making birth free do you support making birth free yeah I think that be do you support access to cont we support more cash credits for families who have kids so that they can invest back into their families and take care of better take care of their kids so part of what we do on the public policy side it's smaller than our educational efforts is i w just criticize all of the policies then I'll specifically criticize the ones that are punitive measures against women or against doctors who are facilitating this type of reproductive healthare that's not something that's going to help people unfortunately and and I'm assuming that there's there's a lot of ideological similarities with a lot of other conservative movements um so when it comes to things like gun rights what I hear so much from conservatives are guns are something that's a necessary evil if there was a world where we could get rid of all guns that would be awesome it's just one thing where there are going to be bad people with guns and in order to counteract that you're going to need good people with guns and I would say the same thing for abortion I think in in an Ideal World We wouldn't have any abortions unfortunately the reality of the situation is it's going to exist whether or not that it's legal and can have safe um actual procedures or it's going to happen in the Alleyways where it is going to damage women and so to continue to advocate for punitive measures and I'll let you speak after this I think that that does more harm to women at large than it does to to help protect The Unborn life here's a question for you do you think that it is always wrong to kill an innocent person an innocent human I would say the intentional killing of of somebody who is innocent is something that we should Advocate against what I will what is an abortion in your view one sec I got to finish my point what I will say is the rights of people's bodily autonomy is something that supersedes the preservation of life especially when it comes to the government enforcement of that do I have the right as a mother to kill my child so I think there are two ways that we determine what rights are in a society right it's either we all have rights and then we decide as a society that there are some actions that we need to restrict just because we live in a social world or we have no rights and we just have the grace of the government that grants us some right question I would start is I think that we do have all rights I think that we restrict things that would be necessary and bad I wouldn't count somebody's rights to their own B autonomy as something that we need to so it sounds like you're saying making the argument that dependency means that a mother should have the child to end the life should have the right to end the life of her child I would say depend the child's dependent on her body right that's what you're saying I'm assuming you're going to go into like a toddler's dependent in order to be fed by their parents a newborn is totally dependent on their parents we can never end the life of a newborn I know but it doesn't rely on the specific bodily functions fully relies on the on the functions of everybody else no because you can opt out you can give that to relies on the functions of other adults have to do with that biological mother the mother put it up ad they you're saying let me make sure I'm say it back to you you're saying the biological mother has the right to end the life of her biological child but somebody else who's not biologically connected could end the life of a young child that's totally dependent on them physically no I wouldn't say that then what are you saying well you like to go into a lot of bi biology do you know what an fmt is tell me so it's a feal microbacterial transfusion it's necessary for people who don't have proper intestinal um responses for immune disorders and what it is is basically a transfusion of someone else's feces into that person um what's funny to me what's funny to me is we don't enforce people in order to like collect their own poop in order to preserve life so it's funny that we protect the sanctity of people's poop over people's ws and uterus the womb is designed for aaby a baby right not all woms can designed for bab what else are they designed for I hate to do it guys I don't I hate interrupting you but it's the only way to to keep the no worries rotating nice to meet you good to meet you thank [Music] [Applause] you Alex nice to meet nice to meet you Alex so your claim is that abortion cannot be justified under any circumstances is that right correct well I want to tell you a story so I'm from Florida and I remember when I heard the story of Ana cook and her husband Derek uh they really wanted to have a baby um and they kept on trying and trying and they had miscarriage after miscarriage after miscarriage and then finally they were able to conceive and you know the pregnancy kept going and they reached 16 weeks and they were so excited because they were finally going to have a baby and they went out for dinner to celebrate it and on the ride back home uh Ana felt something going down her leg and she said I really hope that's not what I think it is uh but it was and it turned out that her water had broken she had to go to the emergency room and they turned her away because even though the pregnancy was completely not viable and the doctor said um you're going to lose your baby without a doubt 100% but if we uh gave you a procedure right now um it would count as an abortion uh under Florida's 15we abortion B this isn't even when they went um to the six week abortion B in Florida this was when it was still 15 weeks um they said this because you're 16 weeks that would count as an abortion we could go to jail we could lose our medical license we can't operate on you so she had to go home with her still born baby that she had been so looking forward to having still inside her um and the next morning she felt so sick and she said that she thought she was going to die but she wanted to get her hair done first so that her mom didn't have to get her hair done so while she was at the hairdresser she felt like something was going to happen so she got out of the chair went into the bathroom and that is when she saw her baby and she had to call her husband in and her husband took care of her um and then she was bleeding out all over the floor everywhere she ended up losing half of the blood in her body that day they operated on her for 8 hours and Derek and all of her whole family was there praying for her the whole time um and miraculously she survived but she would not have had to go through that if she was able um to get the medical care that she need and this is why I think that instead of having the government legislate oh abortion should be illegal except um in this case that case the other case we it's it's impossible to have something so black and white as the law legislate something that is so individualized and so complex as every person's experience and that's why I will always trust um a mother and her family to make the right decision for her instead of the government trying to make things so black and white and that's what abortion banss do they cause people to get really sick and even die uh because they're denied the medical care that they need okay so I'd love to respond thank you for sharing the story here's the deal if the baby had passed away was you mentioned the baby was stillborn or you said that used the word still birth if the baby was was dead if this was a miscarriage the baby was dead it was medical malpractice for the the e mer room to turn her away and she would have had a lawsuit against them in any pro-life state in the in the country any kind of care for miscarriage to complete a miscarriage if the baby has passed away is completely legal and that's actually written in the books so I think that's a really important point that medical malpractice unfortunately does happen and that could have happened in the case abortion B actually caus doctors to have to do medical Mal practice saying that but that's inac to justify oh if it's this exception or that exception there are there are thousands of medical professionals including many in proe States who say we are able to do miscarriage care we're able to deal with top was still alive her water had broken but her baby was was doomed she it was going to die pause nice to meet you thank [Applause] you hi my name is Dana pan Dana nice to meet you nice to meet you um so I am the executive director one of the oldest Rape Crisis centers here in the nation and one of the things that I need you to understand is that abortion care is health care for survivors and it also gives them the options that they need in order to move forward after they have had so many choices that have been taken away from them so let's remind ourselves that most women um who have been um who have been assaulted know their assaulters um one in 20 women who have had pregnancies have had pregnancies that result from assault in addition one in four women have had abortions um so these are women who are making these choices because they need to make these choices and when you say to someone who has already had choices taken away from them that in addition to I have had my body violated I have had my choices taken from me that I then have to car carry a child to birth and then have my life put in danger and reminding ourselves that as a black woman as a black woman I have a higher rate of death in our society just by birthing so I'm putting my life in danger just to carry a child that has resulted from an assault so you cannot tell me that there is no circumstance where I don't make that choice for my body and for the tissues that are in my body there is always a space for me to make a choice for what is going to happen to my body I'd love to respond if I may first of all we are aligned that is absolutely horrific we are aligned on that and part of the work at live action is we do interview survivors of sexual assault and we talk to survivors of sexual assault as well as children conceived via sexual assault that's part of their story and we're aligned that it's absolutely horrific where it sounds like we're not aligned is that I don't believe that two wrongs make a right that if there is a horrific Act of an assault if I may just explain my position here if there's a horrific Act of assault a rap and a pregnancy results a new life is conceived that ending that new life giving that new human being the death penalty for just finished the crime of there been a fertilization there has been a fertilization of an egg if I may finish if I may finish so as an example my friend Rebecca keing or my friend Ryan bomberger two amazing people conceived in brutal RS and they go around and they say I was that embrio I was that fetus I was that unborn baby do I not have a right to live should I have gotten the death penalty for the crime of my father just made a choice one more thing to say that mother made a choice that mother made a choice I as I as a person who has been assaulted then get to make that choice for my body that's the difference actually the difference is I get to choose what happens to my body because I didn't get to make that choice without assault I didn't get to make that choice with that rape but I do get to make the choice with what happens with that fertilized egg and that is a problem and when I am sitting here with a 10-year-old child who didn't have a choice about what happened to her body to then say You must you must carry that child until you give birth that is that is uncons if I can respond with a couple things that are really important I think first of all Rebecca keing my friend who was conceived in her mother tried to have an abortion it was illegal and she couldn't access one so she ended up placing Rebecca for adoption and Rebecca goes around and says what about my right to life and she ended up meeting with her mother years later and her mother said I'm actually glad I wasn't able to end your life glad I can just finish if I can just finished one of the key things that we need to be we need to acknowledge is that abortion isn't something that's going to heal a abortion does abortion I'd love to respond to you I'd love to just have a moment abortion can add trauma it's another act of violence it does not add trauma there is no evidence that abortion adds drama if I may respond in the state of California 200,000 Medicaid patients women 1 15% more likely to commit suicide for those that had an abortion if I may just finish those there is no psychological evidence corelation there is actually correlation to the trauma of having to carry the birth to term there is correlation to the trauma of the early delivery may be the right decision because keep in mind what is an abortion it's the forced birth of a dead fetus or embryo an abortion is the forced birth of a dead an actual medical procedure to remove tissue from your body so that you are what kind of tissue is being removed in an Abortion fetal tissue of what of what of a what of a fetus of a fetus and what is a fetus a fetus could could a fetus could grow to be aive birth so is the fetus alive not necessarily if the fetus is dead why do you have to have an abortion well you have to have an abortion to remove the fetus from is already dead I have no problem with removing a de if the baby's alive what what is is the fetus alive when you're doing an abortion an elective abortion so sometimes a fetus is not alive when you do an elective AB we would agree that that would be a miscarriage and we are both absolutely bab already pass absolutely not because there clear I am only against an abortion that is intentionally taking the life of an innocent human thank you thank you hi hi I'm nice to meet you nice to meet you um so your claim is that there's no right for abortion under any circumstance at all which obviously I disagree with because I'll just Define abortion really quick just for clarity because it was you don't need to for me the intentional killing of a living whatever you want to call it I don't disagree with it anyway so my point though is that there is there should be exception I mean I think you should be able to get it if you want one but under any circum the 10-year-olds that are which you know that 10-year-old in Ohio who is by her father then was told she couldn't have an abortion had to go to a different state so you're more than comfortable with holding down a 10-year-old once again to make her do something with her body she doesn't want to do so an abortion is another act of violence in my view both of that baby and of a Survivor I think this view that we have that abortion is somehow going to heal a surviv crying and Begg you I don't want to give birth I don't want to carry it for 9 months I don't want to be a mom I think she deserves the best support and care she needs to be taken out of that AB care in this case would be an abortion but but we can't take the life of innocent child I think in that case in that case an early delivery you're affording no you're affording more empathy toward a zygo more than you are a living breathing 10-year-old who just went through something seriously traumatizing so your empathy is in a place I don't understand if I if I can respond you can absolutely so is absolutely horrific incest is absolutely horrific we are completely aligned on that we need more penalties for abusers I think one of the things that I have about that case that I've seen is there's no story about what happened to her abuser what she protected from her abuser it's like that's left out of the narrative father I mean but what I've heard you say before prot you shouldn't punish a child for what you called generational sin but if I can if I can finish if I can finish but which child are you not which child you the cas you got let me make the case you got worried about punishing a child but which one the 10-year-old who was already punished can I respond now you can in a case of incest and there's a new life that's been conceived there's another human being now we're talking about it's not just the abuser and the victim there's another potential victim and we need to care for both they're both human beings and in the case of a very young girl who's been the victim of a horrific assault the idea you want hold her down the idea well in an abortion you're literally held down and you have to submit your body to an act that will deler done you're speaking for no we're talking about the 10-year-old who wanted to get that abortion but the point here is is that there are human rights now in in play for an unborn child and a born child they both have rights and I think the medical care is very key as well as the counseling and the support that she deserves and probably an early delivery would be what would be necessary to protect her health and to make sure that the baby would have a chance to live but at the end of the day you don't give the death penalty to the baby because they were conceived by a rapist because their father is an abuser we don't even give the death penalty in this country to were you aware of that my question for you can't even get the penalty for why would we be okay with giving the death penalty to a child because they're conceiv it's not a child are theyo it's an embo I'm not going to get into the science behind it because the the thing you don't think the Science Matters not in this argument right now because you think there's no right for an abortion for any reason but definitely are like Nancy Davis in Louisiana who her her child is going to be born with the crania meaning without a skull you thought and you said this to her you said I think your child should have died in the loving arms of their parents instead of at the tools of the abortionist now this woman was going to give birth to a child that will die within minutes of being born so you're not bringing life into the world at that point you know what abortion procedure would have been done on her baby do you know what abortion procedure would have been done on her baby in a later term abortion that she had in the second trim if I can just complete what I'm my sentence here either there would have been a lethal injection of that baby to kill that baby or that would have been a live dismemberment of that baby those are the abortion procedures used in the second or the third trimester and you don't think either one should have been but you support that do you support that thank [Applause] you hello nice to meet you nice to meet you too you're very brave you are too so um I would like to ask you so I an abortion at all levels whenever the person chooses but I would like to ask you why you think the attention and responsibility and all the the shame that you guys give to people that get abortions instead of the the father like why are we spending so much time on punishing the woman or the person that got pregnant and not the person that made them pregnant when they can control when they ejaculate women can't control when we ovulate so really if you want to have responsibility it should be with the person who bothered the child I think you're totally right that men bear equal responsibility for any pregnancy and I'm I'm well I would say it's equal it takes two to make the baby and I think not always sometimes you get held against your will well in that case yes it's even more horrific and the man not only is responsible but he should be put in jail I mean that's even a horrific situation right so we're not used your efforts for that but well I think I'm not sure how familiar are with our work but a lot of our work includes reporting on women who are being coerced into having abortions by men who would not take responsibility for that baby that was conceived but that's completely separate a lot of men especially abusive men they see their subjective abuse that woman if she gets pregnant or that girl if she gets pregnant they see that as a a something in the way of them being able to continue to abuse and use her they don't want her to be pregnant and so one of the research reports that we've done shows that in the life of a sex trafficking victim she'll have up to at least one and up to multiple forced abortions in her life because her pimp doesn't want her to be pregnant because he can't monetize her basically so this is some of the horrific underside of the abortion industry that they actually profit off of coerced abortions raped abortions traffic victim AB pregnant and not the perpetrators what do you mean by shaming you're the one saying that women or people that are get pregnant are not making decisions that are right for their own bodies you're empathizing them and then you're also not putting responsibility on people that actually caus the situation well if it's a rapist we are in full I think we're probably in full agreement that they should be held fully criminally responsible and put in jail for the rest of their life in my f to say that but the conservatives do not act like that they act like it's entirely women's responsibility the pr I can only speak to myself here and my organization and we work with liberals we work with conservatives we work with Republicans we work work with Democrats so we're a nonpartisan organization it's nice to meet you nice to meet [Applause] you hey before we go any further we want to take a moment to say thanks so much to straight arrow news for powering the fact checks in this video straight arrow news is an app and website that is on a mission to raise the bar on journalism in a time of media bias and mistrust their team of journalists believe that unbiased news should be the standard and not just the exception so they report down the- Middle with facts delivering news without bias filter or spin plus their media Miss tool allows you to discover news that's being under reported or not even reported at all by different sides of mainstream media that's why we're so happy to be partnering with straight arrow news the work they're doing gives us a complete picture of the news straight from our phones and tablets with their app go to s.com surrounded or click the link in the description to check it out by clicking that link you're not just supporting this channel you're also supporting a group of journalists that are raising the bar on news and focusing on serving you unbiased straight facts thanks again to straight arrow news for partnering with us on this episode now let's get into it my next claim is every unborn child has the right to [Music] life [Music] right nice to meet you what's your name Adam Adam nice to meet you like West So when you say a child I feel like you're kind of like preemptively loading the prompt with a lot of emotions um a child implies a person and I don't believe personhood begins until around 22 weeks of gestation when if you want to get into the Neuroscience calamus connects to the the cortex and the Brain finally has a capacity to support a subjective experience so why do you think that a fetus at 10 weeks 8 weeks for example that has no capacity to be self-aware to experience pain or anything else should be valued equal to the bodily autonomy of a woman okay so a few questions for you to get to answer that yeah is do you believe that a fetus a human fetus is a human it's a human yeah sure okay yeah so your argument is that some humans don't have human rights because my argument is that every human has a human right is life this is getting into semantics like colloquial way we use the word human versus maybe a more scientific way so obviously a fertiliz EG and Beyond has human cells the question is when we talk about protecting that life when does it become on the same level as the life of the mother who has bodily autonomy uh and the answer there is 22 weeks because again prior to that there's nothing there's the car is on but there's no driver in the car and you don't apply traffic loss to an empty car right there has to be a subject present it can't be a some thing it has to be a some one so does a a newborn baby have the same capacity brain abilities as a three old uh no and does it has the same capacity for Consciousness though because the thalamus and cortex are connected so you're defining human life as Consciousness that's your definition yeah the ability to have a subjective experience Consciousness sure so if someone is unconscious are they no longer a human they still have connections with their Thalamus and cortex whether under gen or anesthesia whether they're asleep whether they're they're a coma you would say they're still human they still have the neural Pathways connecting those parts of the brain if you're an unborn child before you've developed your brain fully right because we all started life sure before our brain was developed right and then eventually after a few weeks we would develop our brain and then develop more capacities with our brain but that child before it has developed its brain has the natural capacity for a brain because that's what will happen if no one kills that child when you say before it's developed a brain do you mean prior to 22 weeks prior to 22 weeks and and there are parts of a lot has happened in the brain activity even before 22 weeks as I'm I'm sure you know sure but it's not sufficient to support a subjective experience and when you talk about prior to 22 weeks I would agree a potential life has some value but it's not equal value to an actual person who has a right to bodily autonomy if 200 years in the future thanks to like medical technology advancements we can safely remove an eight-week fetus from a mother respect her bodily autonomy and protect the fetus I don't think anyone's going to call for abortion in that situation but the reality is respecting her bodily autonomy typically is mutually exclusive with terminating with keeping that pregnancy so so make sure make sure I'm tracking your argument here you're saying that before this specific moment when there is a a certain level of brain development because the brain has begun Dev connections between brain regions and and and why for you is that the the level of humanity why why for you does that give that person human rights because that includes anyone we'd want to include people that are asleep people under general anesthesia they have a brain developmental disorder where they're missing part of their brainamp and those connections aren't there would you say they're not a human anymore they'd still be a human and like I said but they don't have those brain connections that you're talking about I'm talking about personhood versus being a human like that's what I'm talking about too so I'm saying so I want to be clear with the terms here when you say they're a human I'm agreeing that even if fertiliz egg is a human is it a person that should be given saying that a person with a brain development disorder like a significant develop as an example that they would not be a person in it's okay to kill that person no that's not what I'm saying then what are you saying as I said earlier when there's a potential life a partial life you still give it some value you have to take reasonable steps to protect it if someone's born what steps would you give it to if someone's born with an andil there's no conflict there between the bodily autonomy of a woman and the person with an andil the reason you're do an abortion is not like oh I want to kill this fetus for fun there's a conflict between the woman's bodily autonomy and the fetus developing if there's some way to resolve that and respect both parties that would be great but we don't have that kind of medical technology so the the per position is that if you are a human you have human rights regardless of how developed your brain might be because some people have severe developmental disabilities and that doesn't make them less of a human or they have less said it do well your argument actually infers that it does actually because it's saying that this particular level of Developmental ability that your brain may have gives you which exists by the way in pretty much anyone other than people then andly and those people usually die in a couple days but is it okay to kill that person before they die naturally because they lack this if they're still in the wom or after birth but what if they're okay let's let's take your scenario what if they're after birth and they lack the specific connections that you're saying defin person they have a brain stem usually and they're and they after birth there's a little boy named Jasper he lived almost I think three four years um with a severe condition a developmental condition in his brain it's not okay to kill that kill that but why would it not be okay to kill them when they lack this specific brain connection that you're saying makes it okay to kill the baby the reason it's okay to kill the the fetus prior to 22 weeks is not because it's just good enough itself it's because it's the only way to resolve the conflict between the bodily autonomy of the woman and the fetus if someone's born with anany their existence is not impeding on the bodily autonomy of anyone else and then you want to take all reasonable steps to help that person not harm that person so I think we agree on bodily autonomy to a degree because I agree that I have bodily autonomy you have bodily autonomy but I think my bodily autonomy ends when another human being's bodily autonomy begins eveny outweigh yours though so it's not that it outweighs it's that they two lives like it would not be right for me to be killed by you right I have a right to live and similarly if I had another body inside my body that was a developing human being which is what pregnancy involves right maybe one maybe two they have a right to live and to not be killed so I don't have the right even though there is a responsibility I now have they're using my body to develop that's how we all became in our life then that child still has a right to not be killed parents have natural why does woman not have a right to have her bodily functions kept intact and have like her bodily autonomy kept intact when when you can deliver the baby sure deliver the bab the wom designed for what is the womb designed for like gestation gestation of what the baby right so the womb is designed for the baby nice job thank you nice to meet you [Applause] Adam hello hello again hello so my first question is are you familiar with an anime or a manga series called monster I'm not tell me about it in Monster essentially you have a doctor and this doctor has a choice he has a choice to decide between either saving this young boy's life or saving the life of I believe it's a sponsor of the hospital he chooses to save the young boy's life this young boy grows up to be the titular monster worse than Hitler does that child have a right to life yes every child has a right to life even if they turn out to be the most monstrous thing you could possibly produce even if even if their life means the life life ending of everyone here does their life still hold I believe monsters are not born they're made so just because a child might eventually do something when they grow up and become an adult doesn't mean we have a right to kill them before that I don't know what went on in there childhood are the choices that they made but at the end of the day everyone has a right to life especially a child they're innocent let's say this child grows up and their life is miserable to the point of where they would want to end their life and that's going to obviously leave some kind of Ricochet effect everybody's going to be desperately devastated by that would you say that the parent who believes that that is where their child's life is going does that child still deserve the right to life are you saying that if a child is being abused then we should be support in support of killing that child then let me be more specific what would you say to me as someone who is a third generation suicide Survivor it's my mother my grandmother and their lives were miserable I'm so glad that you're here and I'm so sorry that that's part of your history and that that your your your mother your grandmother endured that and I'm so glad that you're here I think your life is awesome and I think every life is awesome now would you say the same if you knew that I was living in a domestic violence shelter where I consider taking my life frequently would you still say that I don't deserve to not only not only in that life but especially somebody who did have an abortion and somebody who had to make the decision to escape their abuser their Predator their captor someone who is trafficked imp pimped would you still say that raising that child under those still circum ances would have either made my life difficult or would you still say that child has a right to life if I made the decision I don't want to be tied to a predator for the rest of my life I don't want to be tied to my captor for the rest of my life so if someone's dealing with horrible abuse and I hope that didn't happen to but if you were dealing with I am and I'm so sorry that's absolutely horrible you deserved much better you deserved to be taken out of that rescued from that and given a better life and that would be my hope for every person and what I'd want to work towards for every person as opposed to saying death is the answer or a suicide is the answer or abortion is the answer I think choosing life is is always better now what would you say if I were to say thank you appreciate [Music] it hello hi Whitney shanan Whitney nice to meet you so first I'm a mother awesome congrats and I know you're a mother too yes and I think that as mothers having our bodily autonomy the right to control our own body and make our own decisions especially when it comes to pregnancy is Paramount and I think that calling an unborn child an embryo or fetus and unborn child as mothers is disingenuous and it is disempowering for us I don't know how a child would fit in my uterus it doesn't even really make sense so when we're talking about an unborn child I think we should say in this space like out of respect for everyone it's a fetus it's an embryo you know the meaning of the word fetus yes what is it it's an a baby an baby I'm not here to argument anything scientific with you I'm here to talk about bodily autonomy science does matter the bodily autonomy is what I'm here to talk to you about well I think both matter right so the science tells us you just had a guest who argued science with you I'm not a scientist I'm a mother I am too but I'm saying the science I think does matter okay I'm so glad I matters you everyone here has a different reason why abortion rights matter to them and as me a mother and as someone who in a red State when they were trying to pass a 6 week heartbeat abortion ban I went into the ER and I was questioned about what I had done to cause a possible miscarriage because at that time the state legislature was working to ban abortion at 6 weeks and I was 11 weeks and I was turned away I was questioned about what I had done I want wanted that pregnancy I want another pregnancy I have a child I want to stay alive for my child so my bodily autonomy is the Paramount is the most important thing and to say women's bodily autonomy should be sacrificed for a hypothetical baby a hypothetical child because a pregnancy that is not a child it's a baby it's a fetus and it's an embryo so I'd love to respond to what you're saying um first of all well first before you respond I just want to hear one argument cuz I have never heard anyone from your organization make an argument of why the government or you or anyone knows better for my body than me so I'd love to respond if I how you know better about my body than me so I I don't know your body personally OB anyone body but your own you shouldn't be making decisions resp I'd love to respond to what you're saying so your argument is that bodily autonomy your bodily autonomy is more important than The Unborn child's right life no equal no you didn't listen so you do you have the right to kill your unborn child my bodily do you have the right to kill your unborn child I a right to use my body and my organs however I see kill your unborn child no one has the right to use my body or organs without my consent does that me right son how is it killing him my five is killing that child son needs a kidney or he will die if I don't give him my kidy is that killing him is that killing him if I don't give him my k i can respond I can't we can't have a conversation if I can't respond an abortion is the intentional killing of that child so AB your definition it's a medical procedure it's a healthcare medical proced let me respond so an abortion involves either poisoning the baby to death via an abortion pill it involves suctioning the baby to death in a first trimester abortion it can involve live dismemberment of that baby in a second trimester abortion or in a third trimester abortion involves a lethal injection all those aomy explain what pause Whitney I'm so sorry you voted out by the majority please return to your seat thank you Whitney [Applause] hello hello I'm Brianna Brianna nice to meet you nice to meet you okay so I just want to get some clarification on your definitions here yes how do you define a child what is a child okay great question and great thing to do first of all an unborn child is a member of the human species that is not born yet so that would include a child in the womb or could in include a child that's in an i what are characteristics that are distinct that create the definition of a human how do you define a human a human is a member of the of the um a human species so under the law of biogenesis a human would be The Offspring of a parent in the same species okay so what is the distinction between a human and a living other living organisms and um genetically we might be pretty similar in some ways but there's some key differences what is the key difference the human genetic code is is U substantially different than okay any other could you say maybe a level of awareness is something that distincts us from just you know let's say bacteria or plants or other I see yes we have the ability for reason we have have conscious experience yeah ultimately human beings have a natural capacity to be able to reason and to be able to choose and love and do things that you know animals might have some so say that's a determinative ASP of a human being that's what determines a human being having awareness and a conscious EXP well I mean you know animals have exp but they have the ability to reason ultimately human being have a natural Capac distinct from living other living organisms like plants or but just to be clear human beings have the natural capacity for reason but they don't all have the active capacity so a newborn baby doesn't have an active capacity for language for reasoning for making arguments that a maybe adult would and similarly we all know that an unborn baby is a human even though the blueprints the same as a building like are the blueprints the same as a building no okay so if you go up to and you see the structural Integrity of something that a building's there's all these pieces that they're have set aside someone goes and they vandalize that would they say oh you vandalized the I hear what you're saying but it it the analogy doesn't fit because how does it not fit because unborn baby is not a blueprint okay it's not genome all the the genetic your DNA is a blueprint but the unborn baby is also made of cells which are them like you said the building blocks they're because you even said yourself that cons is what defin happens in the third trimester and we see that actually 90% of abortions occur according to the gut pause pause [Applause] pause hi Evan nice to meet you nice to meet you as well so um my fundamental issue with a lot of prol lifers is they have a misreading or a misunderstanding of why exactly we Grant moral consideration other it is not like your view because we are simply of the human species and a organism under your world viiew and correct me if I'm wrong at the moment of conception that you have a right to life and that right to life is equal amongst all human uh beings is that correct at the moment of fertilization yes we all have anal right life when a single cell embryo so the science shows us at the moment of fertilization well important a single cell embryo comes into existence I'm not even dis from fine so you would prefer a world where there are less rights violation than a world where there are more rights violations is that correct of course okay so in in a world in which uh someone shot and killed a born human baby you would prefer that world over someone uh destroying a tray full of Frozen zygotes under your worldview if those if that is a world in which there are more r
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