Tucker Carlson Breaks With Trump Over Iran War and Israel Policy

[00:00] It's been a long time coming. He's

[00:02] wanted me on his show. I wanted him on

[00:03] my show and finally I got him, which

[00:05] means I'm in danger because I owe him a

[00:07] guest appearance myself. Uh, but he's a

[00:10] former Fox News host, a prominent

[00:12] far-right pundit, and once a staunch

[00:15] supporter of President Donald Trump, but

[00:17] no longer. Since leaving Fox News in

[00:20] 2023, he's launched an opponent talk

[00:22] show and just recently announced his

[00:24] departure from the Republican party.

[00:26] Please welcome for the first time the

[00:28] straight shooter with yours truly, the

[00:30] one and only Tucker Carlson. Tucker

[00:32] Carlson, how you doing, man? How's

[00:34] everything?

[00:35] >> Well, I'm as far right as ever. Who

[00:36] writes this crap far right? What is far

[00:38] right anyway?

[00:40] >> Well, you tell me. You tell me. What

[00:42] What [laughter] What would have been I

[00:44] have no idea what would have been the

[00:46] appropriate What would have been the

[00:48] appropriate introduction for Tucker?

[00:51] cultivated, handsome, aryodite,

[00:54] irresistibly appealing to women and men

[00:56] in a platonic way. Just stuff like that,

[00:58] normal stuff.

[01:00] >> So, you really expect [laughter] you

[01:01] really expect a dude to introduce you

[01:02] like this? Stop that. Stop that. Well,

[01:04] >> no, no, but without look making it clear

[01:06] that you're not attracted to me

[01:08] physically, but you see the appeal that

[01:10] others are so obviously

[01:13] >> taken by. I We'll go with that for now.

[01:16] We'll go with that for now. Let's Let's

[01:17] Let's get Let's get right to it. Tucker

[01:19] Carlson, I mean, you you spoken out.

[01:22] >> Um, you know, once upon a time you

[01:24] supported the president. That is no

[01:26] longer the case. Uh, not to be

[01:28] redundant, but remind our audience why

[01:31] you uh don't seem to be as supportive of

[01:33] President Trump as you once were.

[01:36] >> Well, I supported him. Not only

[01:38] supported him, I campaigned with him and

[01:40] for him and spoke at the Republican

[01:42] National Convention and knew him for 20

[01:43] years and I defended him at Fox, you

[01:45] know, for my entire time there. Um, and

[01:48] I got along with him really well until

[01:50] about 20 minutes ago, actually until

[01:52] February 28th when he launched a regime

[01:55] change war on behalf of Israel with

[01:58] Israel on Iran. A war that every person

[02:02] who was paying attention knew could not

[02:04] be won and that would only damage the

[02:06] United States. And I told him that

[02:07] repeatedly before he did it. And it

[02:10] wasn't from my perspective just a

[02:12] mistake. It was like the end of an

[02:14] entire moment in world history where the

[02:16] United States, you know, has enough

[02:18] power to influence events. That's all

[02:20] done, I think, because of this. And I

[02:23] think it's going to dramatically affect

[02:25] the standard of living in the United

[02:26] States and in Western Europe, which I

[02:27] care about. I think it's the most

[02:30] disastrous decision any American

[02:31] president has made in my lifetime. And

[02:33] nothing comes close. So, you know, it's

[02:35] not that I hate Trump as a person. I

[02:37] feel sorry for Trump. He wasn't able to

[02:39] make an independent decision. He's

[02:41] controlled by another country, but I

[02:43] disapprove of it and I'm outraged on

[02:45] behalf of my country, which is the

[02:47] United States.

[02:48] >> Well, Tucker, why does it have to be

[02:50] that he's controlled by another country?

[02:53] Why can't it?

[02:53] >> Well, it doesn't have to be that way. It

[02:55] shouldn't be Let me explain. He should

[02:56] ever be controlled by another country.

[02:57] >> Just let me ask a question. Just let me

[02:59] ask a question.

[02:59] >> Yeah. Why does it have to be that as

[03:01] opposed to he genuinely feels this way

[03:04] and this is the decision that he made

[03:06] and it's just something that you don't

[03:08] agree with as opposed to him being

[03:10] controlled by another country.

[03:13] Well, I would like that to be true. It's

[03:14] not true. And there are a lot of people

[03:16] demanding that I claim that's true, but

[03:18] I was there and that's not true. It's a

[03:20] fact that he followed Israel into this

[03:22] war. He said it himself and so did his

[03:24] Secretary of State. And there's this

[03:26] frantic effort to by agents of Israel to

[03:28] rewrite history and make us forget what

[03:31] what what just happened in February,

[03:34] which was the United States following

[03:36] the lead of Israel into a war that

[03:39] gravely harms the United States. That

[03:40] just that's what happened. Trump was not

[03:42] for this. I talked to him a lot about

[03:44] it. He made no case to the American

[03:46] public demonstrating that he was for it.

[03:48] He said, "Well, I don't want Iran to

[03:49] have a nuclear program." Okay, that's

[03:51] fair, I guess. I don't really care. But

[03:53] he cared. And then in June, last June,

[03:57] he said he eliminated the nuclear

[03:58] program. And then six months later, he's

[04:00] like, "We have to go to war.

[04:01] >> We have to kill the leader of Shia Islam

[04:03] because of the nuclear." It didn't make

[04:05] any sense. He followed Israel into this.

[04:06] He did this under pressure from Israel.

[04:08] They chose when it started. They chose

[04:10] the parameters of the war. And

[04:12] critically, they were our partner in the

[04:14] war. Like literally went into this war

[04:16] with Israel. I'm not saying that because

[04:17] I'm a bigot or an anti-semite or a Nazi.

[04:20] I'm saying this because that's what the

[04:21] US government told us. So, there has

[04:24] been this effort to lie about what just

[04:27] happened. And I've seen this a lot. I

[04:28] saw it with 9/11. I saw it with the Iraq

[04:30] war. And I'm just not going to play

[04:31] along again because I was there. I know

[04:34] what happened.

[04:35] >> So, my question would be this. He's the

[04:37] leader of the free world. Why does he

[04:39] need to follow anybody? Why is another

[04:41] country leading us as opposed to it

[04:43] being the other way around? How do you

[04:45] explain that?

[04:47] >> Dude, you tell me. I don't have the

[04:49] answer. I said this to him directly. I

[04:51] said, I said this to him during the

[04:53] 12-day war in last June, you know, which

[04:55] Israel started and we didn't benefit

[04:58] from it. Obviously, we went to war

[05:00] again. That was the beginning of the

[05:01] regime change war that they planned and

[05:03] wanted for their own reasons. It had

[05:05] nothing to do with our strategic goals

[05:08] or our interests at all. It only hurt

[05:09] the United States. It killed a bunch of

[05:11] Americans. It's going to drive us out of

[05:13] the region, destroyed all of our bases

[05:14] on the Gulf. It's a disaster. So I told

[05:18] him at the time, you are being led

[05:19] around by the nose by Netanyahu and

[05:21] everyone can see it and you know he

[05:24] didn't like to hear that but it was a

[05:25] fact and it remains.

[05:26] >> What did he say to you when you told him

[05:28] that

[05:28] >> when you said that to him? When you said

[05:30] those words that you just said, what did

[05:32] he say to you? What did you say to him?

[05:34] What what did he say to you in response?

[05:36] >> I think I think you know Trump so you

[05:37] can picture the scene.

[05:39] >> Trump hates confrontation. Direct

[05:41] confrontation. Hates it. Can't deal with

[05:43] it at all. He likes everyone to get

[05:44] along. He likes to tell jokes. And I

[05:46] like this about him. I'm not criticizing

[05:47] it at all. He said, "Oh, no. It's gonna

[05:49] be totally fine. That's not true." And

[05:51] it's fine. It's gonna be great. It's

[05:52] gonna be great. And then he had someone

[05:54] else call and say that he was offended

[05:56] by it, [clears throat] which I

[05:56] understand. You know, I shouldn't have

[05:58] said that. I was I snapped. I was so

[06:00] frustrated. This is embarrassing. I'm an

[06:02] American. Whatever you think of this

[06:03] country, which has treated me very well,

[06:06] and you know, my family's been here

[06:07] forever. I like America. I live here. My

[06:09] kids live here. This hurts America. And

[06:12] I don't like to see the United States

[06:14] humiliated because it's my country and

[06:16] that's humiliating. Why are you taking

[06:17] orders from a country of nine million

[06:18] people with no resources and I'm not

[06:20] even attacking Israel. I'm attacking our

[06:22] leaders who today in the US Congress

[06:25] right now as we're talking are voting to

[06:27] merge the US military with the IDF, the

[06:29] Israeli Defense Force, the group

[06:31] committing genocide in the Middle East.

[06:32] Like

[06:33] >> and why would we be doing that? Why

[06:35] would we be merging with the IDF? Why

[06:37] would the what would be the reason?

[06:38] >> It's totally bonkers. I'll tell you why

[06:40] we're not doing it is because like the

[06:41] overwhelming majority of Americans want

[06:42] it. They don't. Who would want that?

[06:44] What's the upside for us? We're doing it

[06:46] because Israel wants it. And Israel

[06:49] controls our politics through campaign

[06:51] donations at least. And maybe there are

[06:53] other ways that it controls our

[06:54] politics, but there's no debate about

[06:56] it. Now, this is not an anti-mitic

[06:58] conspiracy theory. They My whole life

[07:01] I've watched this. My whole life I've

[07:02] said nothing about it. And in a lot of

[07:04] ways, I was intimidated by the claim

[07:06] that anyone who notices an is an

[07:07] anti-semite. Well, I'm not an

[07:08] anti-semite. I'm never going to be an

[07:10] anti-semite. I abhore anti-semitism and

[07:12] all forms of racism, no matter what they

[07:14] say. I just I'm not for it. So, I'm

[07:16] that's not my motive. My motive is it's

[07:17] true. And trying to bully me into saying

[07:20] it's not true, is not going to work. Why

[07:23] is it happening? I don't know. I and

[07:25] I've said this a million times in public

[07:26] and I I really think we need a national

[07:28] conversation about why the president of

[07:31] the United States not just hurt his

[07:33] country but hurt himself and his legacy

[07:35] and his party and everything that he

[07:37] worked all these years to build trying

[07:38] to stay out of prison and almost

[07:40] murdered by a gunman and butler. All the

[07:42] drama that he went through all thrown

[07:44] away because now he's the president that

[07:47] led us into a war that we cannot win. We

[07:48] cannot win the war. And by the way, if

[07:50] we can win the war, tell me how. Is

[07:52] there a military means by which we open

[07:54] the trade affirm? No. And if there was,

[07:55] we would

[07:56] >> What about the What about the notion

[07:57] What about the notion that you're

[07:58] keeping Iran from capturing a nuclear

[08:00] weapon? That would be their argument.

[08:01] That's what they would say. That's what

[08:02] he's been saying. That's what his

[08:04] supporters have been saying. Iran,

[08:06] remember, he told us, you're absolutely

[08:08] right. Initially, they bombed him last

[08:09] June and they talked about we've

[08:10] obliterated them. We're good. And then a

[08:12] few months later, he bombs him again

[08:14] because supposedly they're a month away

[08:16] from having a nuclear weapon. And we

[08:18] have to stop that at all costs. Even now

[08:20] they'll say you don't want Iran to

[08:22] capture a nuclear weapon. There's plenty

[08:24] of conservatives walking around

[08:25] throughout the country that don't know

[08:26] things nearly as intimately as you do.

[08:28] And that's the excuse that they use.

[08:30] Well, we've got to keep Iran from

[08:31] capturing a nuclear weapon. That's why

[08:33] Trump is doing what he's doing. What do

[08:34] you say to that?

[08:36] >> I mean, it's sad and insulting and no

[08:38] one who thinks about it for more than 3

[08:40] minutes believes it. If there was ever a

[08:43] time when Iran has to get a nuclear

[08:45] weapon is now. Cuz we've just proved

[08:47] what happens when you don't have a

[08:48] nuclear weapon. When you have a nuclear

[08:50] weapon and you're North Korea, a

[08:52] Stalinist slave state, we leave you

[08:54] alone. No one's arguing for an invasion

[08:56] of North Korea on the basis of human

[08:58] right. You know, they're mean to their

[08:59] people. They throw them in concentration

[09:01] camps. They don't have free speech. They

[09:02] don't have democracy. We need to invade.

[09:03] No one's saying that because Iran

[09:06] because North Korea, unlike Iran, has

[09:08] nuclear weapons. So, you can't be messed

[09:10] with when you have nuclear weapons. So,

[09:11] what's the incentive for every nation on

[09:13] the freaking planet is to get nuclear

[09:14] weapons as soon as possible or else get

[09:16] regime change by the United States?

[09:18] Nuclear weapons means other countries

[09:21] have to respect you. Therefore, we have

[09:23] just set in motion an irresistible

[09:26] incentive to get nuclear weapons and

[09:28] Iran will have them at some point.

[09:29] They'll buy them from Pakistan, which is

[09:32] what North Korea did, or they'll create

[09:34] them on their own. They have the

[09:35] technological know-how obviously. But

[09:38] once you kill the 87year-old religious

[09:42] leader of their religion once you murder

[09:44] the Shiite Pope, which we did, you

[09:46] ensure that there is a generational

[09:48] conflict that our grandkids are going to

[09:50] have to deal with. We haven't had a lot

[09:52] of terror attacks in the United States,

[09:53] despite what the liars tell you. We

[09:55] haven't. We're separated by an ocean.

[09:57] We've done a pretty good job of not

[09:58] having those. We're going to have them

[10:00] now. And they are a result of what the

[10:02] Trump administration just did at the

[10:04] behest of Israel. So this doesn't make

[10:06] us safer. hurt. Anyone who thinks it

[10:07] does, I feel sorry for. You've lost your

[10:09] capacity for thinking independently.

[10:11] >> But any normal person of any party is

[10:13] like, "Wait, how does this make us

[10:14] safer?" No, this imperils us. It

[10:16] impoverishes us. It diminishes our

[10:19] power. Makes us more vulnerable,

[10:20] obviously. And I said this to Trump and

[10:22] he didn't disagree, but he did it

[10:24] anyway. He didn't disagree, but he did

[10:27] it anyway. You know, I'm going to get

[10:29] back to that. I'm going to get back to

[10:30] the Islamic contingent about it, but I

[10:32] want to go back to the Jewish contingent

[10:33] in this regard. I want to because you

[10:36] you you made a made it a point to point

[10:38] out you're you you don't engage in

[10:40] anti-semitism. You don't support it. You

[10:42] don't believe it. You don't believe

[10:42] you're a part of it, etc., etc. When

[10:44] people talk about some of the things

[10:46] that you said, I want to some

[10:47] controversial comments that you've made

[10:49] in regards to the Gaza war. You called

[10:51] Israel's actions genocide, ethnic

[10:53] cleansing, murder of thousands of

[10:55] children, and a land grab. You described

[10:57] it as losing morality, treating Arabs,

[11:00] quote, like animals or subhumans, end

[11:02] quote, and incompatible with Western

[11:04] civilization values. You visited Gaza

[11:07] refugees and highlighted child

[11:08] casualties. There's absolutely nothing

[11:10] wrong with that, by the way. But I would

[11:11] ask you,

[11:12] >> no, that sounds like Nazi behavior, like

[11:14] worrying about children who are injured.

[11:16] I mean, first of all, everything say,

[11:20] what are y'all talking about? I'm sorry.

[11:22] Go ahead. Go ahead. I apologize.

[11:23] >> It's a slander. Look, if you're

[11:25] committing genocide, which Israel

[11:27] currently is in Gaza, and genocide is,

[11:30] you know, we have an international

[11:31] definition of it, which everyone signed

[11:33] on to up until about 20 minutes until

[11:35] Israel started committing it. And it is

[11:37] the systematic effort by a government to

[11:39] eliminate a people. And I don't have to

[11:41] guess about this because Israeli cabinet

[11:43] ministers and the prime minister of

[11:45] Israel repeatedly have said that's their

[11:47] goal. They describe the Palestinians as

[11:49] Amalcch. I'll refer you to the Old

[11:51] Testament or Hebrew scriptures, whatever

[11:53] you want to call it. our Bible and

[11:54] theirs in which Amalcch is the

[11:56] Amalachites and that's the group that

[11:58] God tells the ancient Hebrews to kill

[12:01] all of them including their children,

[12:03] their babies and their livestock. And

[12:05] the prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu

[12:06] has used this phrase multiple times, not

[12:08] just randomly once again and again and

[12:11] again in speeches and so have his

[12:12] cabinet ministers, the finance minister,

[12:13] the defense minister.

[12:14] >> They've all said the point is we have to

[12:16] kill all these people and drive them

[12:18] out. Well, that is the definition of

[12:19] genocide. Don't take my word for it.

[12:21] Israeli human rights groups are calling

[12:23] it genocide. The rest of the world is

[12:25] calling it genocide. The prime minister

[12:27] has been indicted in international court

[12:28] for genocide. There's no debate about

[12:30] whether it's genocide. The debate is why

[12:32] are we going along with this and

[12:34] allowing people who are committing

[12:35] genocide to give us moral lectures. Like

[12:38] I'm not the criminal for noticing what

[12:40] you're doing. And I'm not going to take

[12:41] a moral lecture from Adolf Ikeman. Why

[12:43] would I? This is crazy. And by the way,

[12:45] future generations will realize that

[12:47] it's crazy. So crazy it's going to be

[12:49] hard to believe it happened. So what was

[12:51] what how would you answer the question

[12:53] if somebody were to have asked Tucker

[12:54] Carlson is your issue with the Jewish

[12:57] community? Is it with Israel? Is it

[12:59] specifically with Benjamin Netanyahu? I

[13:02] mean who's the issue with because that's

[13:04] somebody that you you've described.

[13:06] >> It's not a mystery. I've said it out

[13:08] loud. By the way, you know, I have I I

[13:12] hate even to go there because it's so

[13:13] low. It's playing their game. But it's

[13:16] also a fact that I have a lot of Jewish

[13:18] friends and Jewish guests on the show

[13:20] making exactly the same points. The idea

[13:22] that the government of Benjamin

[13:24] Netanyahu speaks for all Jews on planet

[13:26] Earth is a lie. It's a lie that's going

[13:28] to do grave damage to Jews. I don't know

[13:31] why people go along with this. If some

[13:33] lunatic stood up, some lunatic white

[13:35] person said, "I speak for all whites." I

[13:37] would say, "You don't speak for me." If

[13:39] Lewis Farrakhan stands up and says, "I

[13:40] speak for all black people." I hope

[13:41] you're like, "No, not for me." Like this

[13:44] idea that some politician in a foreign

[13:46] country gets to speak for global jewelry

[13:48] is insane. I'm not playing along with

[13:50] it. But here's the point. They are

[13:52] committing genocide. The lessons that I

[13:55] learned as I'm 57 as a child growing up

[13:57] in America were really clear. Genocide

[14:00] is always wrong. The Nazis did it.

[14:01] That's why we don't like the Nazis. The

[14:04] the the Hoous in Rwanda did it. I mean,

[14:07] the Turks did it. The Ottoman Turks did

[14:09] it against the Armenians. It's always

[14:11] wrong. And the person committing

[14:13] genocide doesn't get to attack me on

[14:15] moral grounds for pointing it out. This

[14:17] is crazy. And everyone else sees it.

[14:20] Only in the United States are we like,

[14:21] "Well, are you an anti-semite because

[14:23] you don't like genocide?" No, I'm a

[14:24] human being. I'm against it when it was

[14:26] aimed at Jews. I'm against it when BB

[14:28] Netanyahu does it. I'm against it when

[14:30] the hoous do it. I'm just against it

[14:32] because it's immoral. And if we can't

[14:33] say that genocide's immoral, where does

[14:35] that leave us? And why are we paying for

[14:37] this? That's the other thing. It's not

[14:39] just some academic like, are you for

[14:41] genocide? Well, obviously I'm opposed

[14:42] I'm opposed to killing innocents always,

[14:44] including bombing girls schools in Iran,

[14:46] >> as most decent people should be against

[14:48] killing innocent without

[14:49] >> all decent people. But if you're doing

[14:52] that, again, I'm not taking a moral

[14:54] lecture from someone who's committing

[14:56] genocide, and none of us should. And

[14:58] through aggression and intimidation,

[15:00] they've scared the living crap out of

[15:03] everyone in the American media,

[15:04] apparently, including you, into this

[15:06] place where it's like,

[15:07] >> what apparently including me? Why is it

[15:09] including me? I'll tell you why. I'll

[15:11] tell you why. Because because the fact

[15:14] you're asking it when the facts about

[15:16] what the Israeli government have done in

[15:17] Gaza are transparent, widely known,

[15:21] provable. You can use only Israeli

[15:23] sources for those facts and still arrive

[15:25] at the same conclusion Israelis have

[15:26] arrived at.

[15:28] >> Let me put let me put you on pause for a

[15:31] second or for one second. When it comes

[15:32] to me, sir, most people in my audience

[15:35] most people in my audience may not have

[15:37] heard what you had to say. I want them

[15:39] to hear from you. So, I'm just asking.

[15:41] Oh, no. No. Nobody's got me

[15:42] hoodwinkedked. I'm literally asking

[15:44] because I literally want to hear like

[15:46] there there's several things that you

[15:48] may have brought up that I may not have

[15:49] heard I may be hearing you say for the

[15:50] first time cuz I don't get a chance to

[15:52] watch you all the time. That's all it

[15:54] is. I want you to know

[15:55] >> it crazy. No, but it's not just me. I

[15:57] mean, by the way, I should say I spent

[15:59] like 35 years never saying anything

[16:01] about Israel. Okay? So, it's not like

[16:02] I'm some courageous voice who's bringing

[16:04] this to the world's attention. This has

[16:05] been going on for a very long time since

[16:07] 1948 to varying degrees. And for the

[16:10] last three years, it's been going on at

[16:13] a pace that's impossible to ignore. And

[16:16] only in the United States, I just want

[16:17] to say it again, only in the United

[16:19] States and Israel. Is this not a

[16:21] majority view widely known by everybody.

[16:23] They've killed tens of thousands of

[16:26] children. They have killed scores of

[16:28] journalists, over a hundred journalists.

[16:30] They bombed churches and hospitals. They

[16:32] bombed and destroyed all civilian

[16:33] infrastructure. And they're driving

[16:35] people out and they're saying it.

[16:36] They're saying it out loud. What? And

[16:38] because of YouTube, we can actually

[16:40] watch this now. And it's like, oh,

[16:41] there's an Israeli official saying we're

[16:43] going to put them in concentration

[16:44] camps. And it's like, the United States

[16:46] could stop this. It's the only country

[16:47] on the planet that could stop it because

[16:48] we're paying for it. And it's I'm not

[16:51] even mad at the Israelis. I think

[16:52] they've gone insane. I think they will

[16:54] be punished for what they're doing in

[16:55] the same way the Germans were punished

[16:57] for what they did. In exactly the same

[16:59] way because

[17:00] >> Are you talking about the government or

[17:01] you talking about the people? Are you

[17:02] talking about the government? Are you

[17:03] talking about the people? I'm talking

[17:04] about I'm I'll be specific. I'm talking

[17:06] about okay

[17:07] >> the government ministers who ordered

[17:09] this. I'm talking about the people who

[17:11] carried it out, the good Israelis who

[17:13] were committing genocide. And in some

[17:15] sense, their victims as well. And I feel

[17:17] sorry for all of them because you can't

[17:19] lie your way out of 75,000 dead bodies.

[17:24] Okay? You just can't. There's no getting

[17:25] around that. You did it. Everyone saw

[17:27] you do it. So, they're going to be

[17:28] punished. I'm outraged at American

[17:31] officials for paying for this and for

[17:34] attacking anybody who says, "Wait a

[17:36] second. Why are we paying for genocide?

[17:37] I thought we were against genocide. We

[17:38] have got a Holocaust museum in my town

[17:40] that says genocide is bad. Is it not bad

[17:42] now?" And they're like, "Shut up, Nazi."

[17:44] It's like, "No, no, I'm against the

[17:45] Nazis because I'm against genocide, but

[17:48] here you're committing it. So, I'm

[17:49] against what you're doing. This is it

[17:51] doesn't

[17:52] >> is yeah is this about just Trump or is

[17:55] it about specific individuals within

[17:57] administration that has an alarming

[17:59] level of influence that we need to know

[18:01] about as well.

[18:04] So that's like a question I've thought

[18:05] so much about. In other words, who was

[18:07] pushing Trump to do something insane?

[18:10] >> There you go.

[18:10] >> Right.

[18:11] >> And you know, obviously Rubio, the

[18:13] Secretary of State is for it. Obviously

[18:16] I I don't think he was pushing that. I

[18:18] mean, I you know, I don't work there, so

[18:19] I was there a lot, but I'm certainly not

[18:21] an employee and never have been. So,

[18:22] there's a lot I miss. I don't I can't

[18:24] really answer the question, but my sense

[18:25] is

[18:26] >> that no one inside the White House was

[18:28] like,

[18:30] >> you know, pushing Trump's arm behind his

[18:31] back and saying, "You've got to regime

[18:33] change Iran." I think it came from the

[18:35] outside. I think it came from outside

[18:37] advisers and donors. Miriam Adlesen, the

[18:39] widow of Sheldon Adlesen, the gambling

[18:41] magnet. I think it came from Rupert

[18:42] Murdoch, the owner of Fox and the Wall

[18:44] Street Journal and New York Post, who

[18:46] called all the time demanding this. I

[18:47] think it was people out. That's what I

[18:50] think. And I think there might also be

[18:52] other reasons that he did this. Joe

[18:53] Kent, who ran the National

[18:55] Counterterrorism Center, said out loud

[18:56] when he resigned, and he would know that

[18:59] he believed the Butler shooting was

[19:01] connected to Trump's move against Iran.

[19:04] Now, look, I can't prove that, but

[19:06] here's one of our top intel officials

[19:08] making that claim. Where's the New York

[19:10] Times following up on that? Not one

[19:12] American news organization has made any

[19:14] attempt to find out what the hell this

[19:15] was, because they all support it. They

[19:17] all support it. They support this war.

[19:19] And that's why there has been no mass

[19:21] movement against it. People like, "Oh,

[19:22] I'm against the war." Really? Well,

[19:23] where are the protests? I I remember the

[19:25] Iraq war. I was there both in Washington

[19:28] and Iraq. There were massive protests.

[19:29] Now, at the time, I was shilling for the

[19:31] Trump administ I mean, for the Bush

[19:33] administration, be like, "No, it's a

[19:34] good idea to invade Iraq." I was

[19:35] completely wrong. And I've been

[19:37] humiliated ever since. But I did notice

[19:39] that the other side had demonstrations.

[19:41] Where are those demonstrations now?

[19:43] They're none because both parties are in

[19:44] favor of this. That's why.

[19:46] >> Do you believe that this has been an

[19:48] impeachable offense by the president of

[19:51] the United States? And if so, what do

[19:53] you believe should happen to him in

[19:55] regards to these actions that he has

[19:57] taken in?

[19:58] >> This is the one thing that Trump has

[20:00] done that he will never be impeached for

[20:02] because Democrats support it. Both

[20:04] parties supported regime change in Iran

[20:07] because both parties have the same pay

[20:08] masters and the same donors who are

[20:11] demanding loyalty to a foreign country.

[20:14] the same Apac donations that like think

[20:17] like 90% of the entire Congress takes

[20:19] money from a foreign lobby, unregistered

[20:22] foreign lobby. That's bonkers. If this

[20:24] were Likenstein or Congo bribing 90% of

[20:27] our lawmakers to tow the Likenstein or

[20:30] Congo line, I'd be totally opposed to

[20:31] it. Doesn't make me anti-Congalles or

[20:33] anti- Likensteinian. I'm not a racist

[20:35] for thinking that. I'm an American who

[20:37] wants my lawmakers to vote on behalf of

[20:39] my country. Like, it's that simple. It's

[20:41] literally that simple. and everybody

[20:42] sees it except the American media which

[20:45] lies because it's controlled and

[20:47] American lawmakers, politicians

[20:50] who are paid to lie. But like now the

[20:52] consequences of it are getting so crazy.

[20:54] We're running out of oil. Trump said

[20:56] that last month. We're weeks away from

[20:58] draining the SPR. We have no cushion on

[21:01] oil.

[21:02] >> And so at some point they're man

[21:04] manipulating markets now. Obviously the

[21:05] markets are totally manipulated. But at

[21:07] some point supply and demand does become

[21:09] real. And if you don't have enough oil,

[21:11] the price goes up. And when the price

[21:12] goes up, so does the price of

[21:13] everything. And you get inflation and

[21:15] people get really poor. And that's going

[21:17] to happen.

[21:19] Tucker Carlson right here with Stephen

[21:20] A. Straight shooter with yours truly.

[21:22] I'm wondering right now you're a life I

[21:25] mean you you've you've stated, correct

[21:27] me if I'm wrong, that you voted

[21:28] Republican pretty much all your life. Um

[21:30] that you've disassociated disconnected

[21:32] from the Republican party, but it's not

[21:34] like you're about to vote for the

[21:36] Democrats either. I'm wondering how you

[21:38] feel right now as somebody who's

[21:41] confessed to being so wrong about the

[21:44] president. And more specifically, what

[21:45] I'm really wondering about with what

[21:47] Trump is doing, that's not something

[21:49] Obama did. It's not something that that

[21:52] that uh that uh George W. Bush did. I'm

[21:57] wondering this president decided to take

[22:01] this action. Where are you now in terms

[22:04] of viewing him compared to the Democrats

[22:06] in light of the fact this is not

[22:08] something that they've done, but yet

[22:09] it's something that he has done? Well,

[22:12] it's something to some extent all

[22:14] American presidents have done since John

[22:15] F. Kennedy was murdered, which is follow

[22:17] the lead of a foreign country, Israel.

[22:20] So, George W. Bush did do it. He took us

[22:22] into a regime change war against Iraq at

[22:24] the urging of Benjamin Netanyahu. I was

[22:26] there. So, that's why we did that.

[22:29] >> That's true. Joe Biden funded the

[22:30] genocide of Gaza. And by the way, there

[22:33] to his credit, you know, there were a

[22:35] lot of people in the Democratic party

[22:36] who were very mad about that and

[22:38] attacked Biden for that. Good for them.

[22:40] I didn't say a word. I was kind of not

[22:42] even aware it was happening, but that

[22:43] was happening and they deserve credit

[22:45] for being honest and decent enough to

[22:46] oppose genocide. So, every president has

[22:49] been bossed around by this tiny country.

[22:50] Bill Clinton got blackmailed by Israel

[22:53] over Monica Lewinsky. did a tape of him

[22:55] having phone sex on Air Force One with

[22:57] Monik Lewinsky and they told him they

[22:59] had it and said they were going to

[23:00] release it unless he took their side in

[23:02] the Y River negotiation. So like this

[23:04] has been going on a long time but Trump

[23:06] just did something that's like quantum

[23:09] levels crazier and more destructive to

[23:11] the US which is this war. How do you get

[23:13] out of this war? I I don't see and no

[23:16] one I know including people who work at

[23:17] the White House and at the Pentagon if

[23:19] you ask that question like how do we get

[23:20] out of this? They have no idea. So, it's

[23:23] I'm really worried about it. I know I'm

[23:25] hated and called a Nazi for being

[23:27] against it, but it's it's bad enough

[23:29] that it's worth it to say it, I think.

[23:32] >> Tucker Carlson, in 2021, you probably

[23:34] wrote that you hated Trump passionately.

[23:37] You later supported him in 2024. So,

[23:39] here's the question. Why should

[23:40] listeners see this latest break as

[23:43] principle rather than another pivot on

[23:45] your side on your part? How do you or

[23:47] how do you answer that? Well, I've had

[23:49] many many pivots and I've already

[23:51] explained two of them. You know, I was

[23:53] wrong. Yes, you have because I'm wrong a

[23:55] lot. You know, I guess I mean I I

[23:57] flatter myself and say I'm not wrong a

[23:59] lot, but I certainly am wrong sometimes

[24:01] and wrong on big things. I was wrong on

[24:02] Trump and I was wrong on the Iraq war.

[24:05] Um, and I'm sure a million other things.

[24:06] But anyway, I mean, I don't know what to

[24:08] say.

[24:10] People can judge whether I'm sincere or

[24:12] not. I don't really know what I'm

[24:12] getting out of this. Actually, I've

[24:14] gotten really nothing out of any of it.

[24:16] And um I'm not going to whine and say

[24:18] I've lost a lot, but some including

[24:21] friendships. So I don't really know what

[24:22] my motive would be, but I if I can't

[24:24] convince people I can't, but I'm just

[24:26] telling you I happen to be there and

[24:28] pretty close and saw a lot of stuff that

[24:30] is like so bad for this country. It's

[24:32] such a total betrayal. Now, I would just

[24:34] say quickly that yeah, I got mad at

[24:37] Trump in a private text message which

[24:39] Fox stole from me and sent to the New

[24:41] York Times. Like that's a whole another

[24:42] story. Kind of crazy. Uh, but I wrote

[24:44] that to one of my producers because

[24:46] Trump had made me mad in 2001 right

[24:48] after the election. Okay, I get, you

[24:51] know, I've been mad at people I love.

[24:53] But I decided that Trump was the option

[24:56] to the Republican leadership and the

[24:58] Democratic leadership. He wasn't a

[24:59] Republican. He was a challenge to the

[25:01] Republicans. He came from outside the

[25:03] system. This was how I thought of it.

[25:04] And as they tried to put him in jail and

[25:06] shoot him and all this stuff, I was

[25:07] like, "See, it's totally real." You

[25:09] know, it's not a fake thing. I mean,

[25:10] they're trying to put him in jail.

[25:12] That's what I thought. And I still kind

[25:13] of think that. But somewhere along the

[25:15] line after that Butler shooting in

[25:17] Pennsylvania in July of 2024, he changed

[25:20] like 180 degrees and started doing

[25:22] things that he ran against doing. And so

[25:26] like you tell me what that is. I don't

[25:28] know. I don't think Trump's a great

[25:29] actor. I don't think he was lying

[25:31] before. I think he something changed

[25:32] him.

[25:33] >> Something changed for him after the

[25:35] Butler shooting. And you just think it's

[25:37] just that simple.

[25:38] >> You and you don't have no idea what

[25:40] >> it's that simple.

[25:42] >> Okay. But you have

[25:43] >> I don't know if anything's simple. Well,

[25:45] let me tell you what I do know. No, I

[25:47] don't. I just to be clear, I don't know.

[25:48] And if I did, I would say it instantly.

[25:50] I know that Trump shut down the

[25:51] investigation into the Butler shooting.

[25:53] It doesn't make any sense. There's a lot

[25:55] of material that the FBI gathered into

[25:57] Thomas Krooks, who he was talking to on

[25:59] his burner phone, who he was talking to

[26:00] online, who he trained with at the

[26:02] range. They have tape of that. They've

[26:04] not released any of it. And I pushed

[26:06] them really hard. The FBI director, the

[26:08] deputy director, the guy in charge of

[26:09] the investigation. I talked to them all.

[26:11] Why can't we see this information? And

[26:13] they wouldn't answer the question. Turns

[26:14] out Trump told them not to release it,

[26:16] to shut down the investigation. He's a

[26:18] lone gunman. He's dead. We don't need to

[26:20] know anymore. Okay, then why can't I see

[26:21] the information that you gathered? Did

[26:23] he have contact with law enforcement

[26:24] before the shooting? Why can't you

[26:26] answer that question? And instead, they

[26:27] yelled at me and called me names. The

[26:29] Trump people did. And I was like, if

[26:31] that's your response, then I think like

[26:33] I've got a bunch of kids and if I say,

[26:34] hey, what are you doing? And they're

[26:35] like, shut up, racist. I'm like, I'm

[26:37] pretty sure you're doing something wrong

[26:39] then if you're attacking me for asking.

[26:40] Like, that's just a tell. And I So,

[26:44] that's all I know, but I can't think of

[26:46] a non-sinister reason for Trump to shut

[26:49] down an investigation into his own

[26:51] attempted murder. Maybe you can, but I

[26:52] can't. I think it's very I think it's

[26:54] one of the weirdest things I've ever

[26:55] seen in my life. And I know that at that

[26:58] moment he started assembling right after

[27:01] that, he started assembling his

[27:02] transition team. And I was really close

[27:04] to that. I knew everyone on it. And all

[27:06] of a sudden these people are like, "Wait

[27:08] a second. Would this guy Why would we

[27:10] appoint John Ratcliffe to CIA when he's

[27:13] the opposite of what you're running on?

[27:15] Like John Ratcliffe is the opposite of

[27:17] what you're promising voters. Why would

[27:18] you do that?" And I noticed this stuff

[27:20] and I was like, "This is very odd." But

[27:22] I didn't kind of put it together cuz I'm

[27:23] not a genius. And then by the time we

[27:25] got to Iraq, Iran, I was like, "Oh, wait

[27:27] a second. I think this whole thing's

[27:29] been in progress for a long time." And

[27:30] the point is not to eliminate Iran's

[27:32] nuclear program. Nobody cares. M

[27:34] >> the point is to reshuffle the deck

[27:37] globally and to diminish the Gulf

[27:39] States, to get the United States out of

[27:40] the Middle East, I think to end the

[27:42] petro dollar to crush Europe. Like there

[27:44] are big things going on and the rest of

[27:46] us are so caught up in whatever BS crap

[27:49] the media is putting on here. We don't

[27:50] see it. But I'm just telling you in 5

[27:52] years it's going to be a different

[27:53] world. I hope a better world, but it's

[27:55] going to be a different world.

[27:56] >> You've got a lot of people connected

[27:58] with Israel. You got a lot of people who

[27:59] are, you know, who who look at Benjamin

[28:03] Netanyahu and let's just say they don't

[28:05] view him the way that you do. They point

[28:07] to your relationships in the Middle

[28:09] East. They talk about Qatar. They talk

[28:11] about you having a home in Doha, stuff

[28:14] like that. Talk about that for a second.

[28:16] Whatever level of legitimacy may come

[28:19] attached to those who

[28:21] >> I mean, I hate defending myself. I mean

[28:23] it's just there I mean these are people

[28:25] who are taking money and direction from

[28:27] a foreign government accusing me of the

[28:30] same and the truth is I don't have a

[28:32] home in Doha. I don't own anything in

[28:35] Doha. I've never taken money from the

[28:36] Qataris or any other government. I don't

[28:38] even have a bank loan. I have no

[28:39] investors. I have no debt.

[28:41] >> You know my opinions. You may not like

[28:43] them but they're mine because I have no

[28:46] control over me at all and I own my

[28:48] company with my college roommate. So

[28:50] that's the extent of my financial life.

[28:52] It's I you know whatever. But you know

[28:55] what I would say this Qatar I love Qar.

[28:58] I really like Qar and the Israelis like

[29:01] Qatar too which is why Benjamin

[29:03] Netanyahu asked the Qatari government to

[29:05] send money to Hamas.

[29:07] >> I'm not guessing. This is you can look

[29:08] it up.

[29:09] >> So it was actually Netanyahu who asked

[29:11] Qatar to send money to Hamas. Now

[29:13] they're like attacking the Qataris for

[29:15] being a tool of Hamas. The whole thing

[29:16] is so dishonest I can't deal with it.

[29:18] But even if I were like being bribed by

[29:20] Qatar to I don't know what Qatar bribes

[29:23] people to do. Even if that were true,

[29:25] you'd still have to contend with like,

[29:26] well, I don't know. Is what he's saying

[29:28] true? Is the Iran war going well? Is it

[29:31] in America's interest? Did the

[29:33] administration say we're following

[29:34] Israel? They did. Is genocide being

[29:37] committed in Gaza? Of course,

[29:38] objectively, the numbers are there. Go

[29:41] on Wikipedia. And so, it's like it

[29:43] doesn't even matter. Yeah. They attack

[29:45] me as a person. I'm a bad person. I'm a

[29:47] Nazi. Okay. Well, I'm not at all, but

[29:49] even if I were, it wouldn't change the

[29:51] fact that you're committing genocide and

[29:53] this war is hurting my country. Like,

[29:56] right. So, since the country is so hurt

[29:59] and we've got a two-party or binary

[30:01] system, Democrats, Republicans, you are

[30:04] not for either side. Obviously, you've

[30:07] been talking about a third party, but

[30:09] your thoughts about that at this

[30:11] particular moment in time. Is that even

[30:13] remotely plausible? And if so, I mean,

[30:16] where do we go from here, Tucker

[30:18] Carlson, based on everything you're

[30:19] telling us about the state of this

[30:21] country right now and how both parties

[30:24] are a bit shady to say the least? Where

[30:27] do we go from here?

[30:29] Well, it's not even that there. Yeah,

[30:31] they're totally shady of course, but

[30:33] they're in agreement on the big issues.

[30:35] And the big issues, just to restate, are

[30:38] the economy and foreign policy. That's

[30:39] where all the money is spent. How do we

[30:42] aortion the spoils in our system? like

[30:44] who gets rich in America? That's the

[30:46] economy. And foreign policy is who do we

[30:49] bomb? Where do we send money? We we have

[30:50] a military that consumes like 80% of our

[30:53] discretionary budget. Okay? It's $1.5

[30:56] trillion a year in funding. So what we

[30:58] do with the military really really

[30:59] matters. The trans stuff, I think it's

[31:01] meaningful. It's crazy, but that's not

[31:04] the pressing issue. The parties disagree

[31:06] on trans. I'm for trans. You're against

[31:08] trans. Okay, great. But on the big

[31:10] questions, they're aligned. They are on

[31:13] the same page. Chuck Schumer agrees with

[31:15] Donald Trump and Trump with Schumer on

[31:17] the tax code. Whatever they say, they

[31:19] agree on the tax code and they agree on

[31:22] the Iran war. So all I'm saying is it

[31:24] would be nice to have an option like

[31:25] someone should have a party for like the

[31:27] rest of us because most Americans don't

[31:28] agree with the tax code and don't agree

[31:30] with the Iran war. So where's their

[31:31] representation now? What am I going to

[31:34] do about it? I was waiting for you to

[31:35] run. So a lot of us are just kind of

[31:37] sitting here being like, where's Stephen

[31:38] A? Is he getting in the race? But if you

[31:40] don't get in, it's like there just

[31:42] should be an a real option cuz otherwise

[31:45] it's not democracy. It's an oligarchy

[31:48] posing like painted. It's actually like

[31:50] a trans oligarchy. It's like an

[31:52] oligarchy pretending. No, I'm really I'm

[31:54] a democracy. It's got like big red

[31:56] lipstick misapplied in a wig. It's like

[31:58] it's too fake. I can't deal with it.

[31:59] >> So, let's play the game. Tucker Carlson.

[32:01] If not me, somebody else or me. If I'm

[32:04] running for president or somebody like

[32:06] me is running for president, what does

[32:08] Tucker Carlson want from the candidate

[32:10] himself that could end up in the

[32:13] presidency? What would you want from us

[32:15] that you haven't gotten from either

[32:17] party?

[32:19] >> I'd want what everyone wants from his or

[32:22] her leaders, what kids want from their

[32:24] dads, what employees want from their

[32:26] bosses, what soldiers want from

[32:27] officers, which is love, concern. That's

[32:29] it. I mean, a lot of these problems are

[32:31] complicated, but you're never going to

[32:33] fix them unless you begin with a desire

[32:36] to help and uplift the people you're in

[32:39] charge of. It's that simple. And if

[32:41] you're having wars with Iran or letting

[32:43] a 100,000 Americans die of drug ODS and

[32:45] doing nothing about the drug cartels,

[32:47] it's pretty obvious you don't care about

[32:49] Americans. And so, there are lots of

[32:51] potential solutions to these problems.

[32:53] And I'm happy to debate them. But we

[32:55] can't even get there until we get

[32:57] leaders who sincerely care about their

[32:59] people. And we don't have that. It's

[33:01] obvious. It couldn't be more obvious.

[33:02] Oh, we're going to let the Epstein files

[33:05] become public. No, we're not. Shut up.

[33:06] Stop asking. Shut up, conspiracy

[33:09] theorist. It's like, what? You obviously

[33:11] hate me. You have contempt for me. And

[33:12] they do. And I would know since I spent

[33:14] my life around them. Not I'm just

[33:16] talking about Trump. I mean, our

[33:17] leadership class. So, we can't have

[33:19] that. We need people who have a sincere

[33:21] love not of the country but of the

[33:24] people who live in the country, the

[33:25] citizenry, the Americans. And we don't

[33:27] have that. And so that's really the

[33:29] first thing I'm looking for. It's not

[33:30] some magic. How do you fix social

[33:32] security? I don't even know, you know? I

[33:34] don't know. It's too complicated. How do

[33:36] you fix schools? I have some ideas, but

[33:38] no one is even trying. Education in

[33:40] America is a freaking joke. Like, it's a

[33:43] joke. You can't send your kids to a

[33:45] public school in a big city or even in a

[33:47] small city. They're terrible and only

[33:49] people have no choice to it. Is there an

[33:51] effort to fix that? No. None. Zero. So

[33:54] like all I want is to see that someone

[33:56] cares. And most people I know feel that

[33:59] way. Like they're sort of post ideology.

[34:01] I don't know the right answer, but I

[34:02] know you don't care at all about finding

[34:05] it. And so up yours. Get out of here.

[34:07] Leave. That's how I feel. Listen, I

[34:10] can't deny what you're saying, but the

[34:11] flip side to it is that you're

[34:13] simplifying it. One would easily argue.

[34:15] You know, when people have heard you

[34:16] talk in the past, whether it's about

[34:18] immigration, whether it's about races,

[34:20] about demographics in this country or

[34:21] whatever, they may not share your point

[34:23] of view. A matter of fact, some people

[34:24] may be put off by some of the things.

[34:26] They may have that have been put out

[34:29] there about you. But again, we don't

[34:31] know how accurate it is. I guess what

[34:33] I'm asking you is when you think about

[34:35] this country, what's your ideal of a

[34:37] perfect America? Because a lot of times,

[34:38] I got to tell you, I'm not going to say

[34:40] you because I haven't seen much of you,

[34:42] even though I used to w try to watch you

[34:44] on Fox News a lot more than I see you

[34:46] right now on YouTube and stuff like

[34:48] that. I'm just a busy guy talking. What

[34:49] can I say? But I I when people talk

[34:52] about you, they they feel like, listen,

[34:55] nationalist point of view, America

[34:58] first, last, and only for the most part

[35:00] until the latest stuff with Israel has

[35:03] come about. And there's a lot of folks

[35:05] demographically in this country that

[35:07] wonder whether or not you vibe and your

[35:09] thinking, your vision for this country

[35:11] vibes with what they would like for this

[35:14] country. Talk about that for a second

[35:16] here. I would I would say um nationalist

[35:19] America first. I mean, there's literally

[35:22] no other acceptable way to run a

[35:24] country. So, if I've got kids and I'm

[35:26] like I like the neighbors kids more than

[35:28] my own, I'm a bad father. Okay. Um, so

[35:32] the only justifiable position in a

[35:35] democracy is put the country first. Like

[35:38] what's the point? Who owns the country?

[35:39] Well, its citizens own the country.

[35:41] Therefore, this whole enterprise, this

[35:42] whole thing is being done on their

[35:44] behalf. So, if I don't put my own

[35:46] country first, I put another country

[35:47] first. By definition, I'm committing

[35:49] treason, which they are. So, it's not

[35:51] about Israel. It can't. Once again, it

[35:53] could be Uruguay. It doesn't matter. You

[35:55] have to protect your people. Nobody

[35:57] disagrees with that. By the way, as for

[36:00] the race stuff, there has been this

[36:01] concerted effort to convince non-whites

[36:03] that whites are the problem. Whites are

[36:05] bad. Whiteness is bad. We hate whites.

[36:07] And to ferment to ferment hatred between

[36:11] the races. Now, why have they tried to

[36:12] do that? Why would you ever do that?

[36:14] Which they have definitely done at, you

[36:16] know, kind of scale for 60 years. Well,

[36:19] because when you're busy hating your

[36:20] neighbor on the basis of his race,

[36:23] they're busy looting your country, which

[36:24] they have done.

[36:25] >> So, it's a diversion tactic. And the

[36:27] truth is,

[36:28] >> if you if you say what I just said to

[36:31] the majority of Americans of any color,

[36:33] they're like, "Well, of course that's

[36:34] right." Like, "What's the purpose of

[36:34] having government if it's not there to

[36:36] help you?" Like, what? Then why do we

[36:37] have it? It's to help BB. Like, what are

[36:40] you even talking about? Of course you're

[36:42] a nationalist. Of course, you're an

[36:43] America first and only. Doesn't mean you

[36:46] hate other countries. Like, I'm not for

[36:48] bombing other countries most of the

[36:49] time, unless they're going to unless

[36:50] they're bombing us. So, like, I'm not

[36:52] against other countries. And by the way,

[36:53] I've been to almost every country in the

[36:55] planet and I like them all. So, it's not

[36:57] that. It's like, why do you have a

[36:59] government? It's to look out for you and

[37:01] your interest. That's why you pay taxes.

[37:03] This whole conversation is like bonkers.

[37:05] But the race stuff is the most

[37:06] upsetting. And what you see when you

[37:09] really drill down because it divides

[37:11] people permanently. They've spent the

[37:13] Democratic party has spent 60 years

[37:15] telling non-white voters that whites are

[37:16] the problem and that whites hate them

[37:18] because they're not white. That's a

[37:20] freaking lie, dude. That's a lie. But

[37:22] what about a lot of black people believe

[37:23] it? But but but Tucker but Tucker as a

[37:26] black man, what about from what about

[37:28] from an historical perspective? Looking

[37:29] at slavery, looking at Jim Crow laws,

[37:31] looking at the iniquitous acts of a

[37:33] white populace that existed in this

[37:35] country, and simply acknowledging, look,

[37:38] that happened, that existed, and we

[37:41] could never come close to letting

[37:42] something like that happen again, policy

[37:45] or otherwise. What's wrong with doing

[37:47] that? Is that

[37:49] >> No, no, no. What I mean is, is it

[37:51] divisive?

[37:52] If

[37:54] >> yeah, Jim Crow is happening again at a

[37:56] larger scale. We have more racial quotas

[37:59] now against whites than we ever had

[38:01] against blacks in the south and in

[38:04] federal contracting, in college

[38:05] admissions, in hiring, in private

[38:07] companies and public companies. It's

[38:09] like, how about the government treats

[38:10] everybody the same? That's the lesson of

[38:12] the civil rights movement.

[38:13] >> Let's treat everyone the same.

[38:16] >> Stay right there. What if I said to you,

[38:17] Tucker, you got a 50-yard head start and

[38:20] guess what? You've been operating at a

[38:22] 50-yard head start for a lengthy period

[38:25] of time. And in order to equal the

[38:27] playing field, I've got to get a head

[38:29] start to be able to catch up to you

[38:31] because essentially that's what you have

[38:33] a black populace or a minority populist

[38:35] in this country articulating to some

[38:37] degree. Anyway, I understand

[38:40] that two wrongs don't make a right. I'm

[38:42] >> right. Okay.

[38:43] >> I'm saying two wrongs don't make a

[38:44] right. I get that part. But if you're

[38:46] talking about see there's a lot of folks

[38:48] within our within this country that are

[38:50] of that mindset and I respectfully

[38:52] disagree but the key word is

[38:53] respectfully because I understand where

[38:54] you're coming from. I'm just simply

[38:56] saying if you've been operating as a

[38:59] society as a community with a head start

[39:02] for a lengthy period of time. How is the

[39:04] playing field ever supposed to be

[39:06] equaled if we were never given a come

[39:08] up? I mean that at some point in time

[39:11] that premise has to be addressed does it

[39:13] not?

[39:13] >> Right. I mean, look, I would say I think

[39:17] it's really important to articulate why

[39:20] racial discrimination is bad.

[39:22] >> And because it's bad, it's always bad,

[39:24] no matter who commits it. Period.

[39:26] >> Okay.

[39:27] >> Period. It's inherently bad to judge

[39:30] people and to punish people on the basis

[39:32] of their skin color. Is that Do you

[39:34] agree with that?

[39:35] >> I agree with that. I agree with that.

[39:36] >> Oh, you do agree with that. What I'm

[39:37] saying to I totally agree. I'm not No,

[39:41] I'm not I'm not disagreeing. I'm simply

[39:43] pointing out that again, if the

[39:46] objective is to have a fair and

[39:48] equitable society for all, how is that

[39:51] supposed to be accomplished if folks are

[39:53] operating from behind the eightball

[39:55] because of years of policies and things

[39:59] of that that subjugated a community in

[40:01] this country? How is that supposed to

[40:02] happen?

[40:02] >> I think that people whose ancestors were

[40:05] dragged here against their will in

[40:07] slavery are at a disadvantage.

[40:10] However, I think it's a lot more

[40:13] complicated than you're saying. I think

[40:15] that that does

[40:17] >> hurt people generationally. Clearly, it

[40:20] does. However, the idea that it's all

[40:23] whites are racist. Then you tell me why

[40:26] whites, and you can check the Department

[40:27] of Labor stats on this if you want.

[40:29] They're on the internet. Whites are

[40:31] like, I don't know, fifth or sixth for

[40:32] for income in the United States. It's

[40:34] not white people, not the rich people.

[40:35] Nigerians, your average Nigerian in the

[40:37] United States makes more than your

[40:38] average white. So tell me if there's

[40:41] this like system. So I guess what I'm

[40:43] also saying is that like this country

[40:45] has become so genuinely diverse. Like

[40:47] when I was a kid, it was black people,

[40:49] white people, some Hispanics, very few

[40:50] Asians, and really no one else.

[40:52] >> And the black people, their families

[40:53] have been here as long as mine, hundreds

[40:55] of years. I mean, their families were

[40:56] dragged here in colonial times, some of

[40:57] them.

[40:58] >> So that was a different picture than

[41:00] what we're looking at now. Now we're

[41:02] going to get to a place by the if in a

[41:04] couple more decades where the majority

[41:05] of black people in the United States are

[41:07] not the descendant of American slaves.

[41:09] So then it's like it's so do we owe

[41:11] affirmative action to anatrian when he

[41:14] arrives on a visa program? I don't think

[41:15] so. So like this whole thing is nuts

[41:17] actually. So the only solution is to say

[41:21] >> slavery is always wrong. Discrimination

[41:23] on the basis of race is always wrong and

[41:24] so let's stop doing it because it's

[41:26] wrong. It's it'd be like saying and they

[41:28] do say it. Well, you know a lot of

[41:30] people who survived the Nazi genocide

[41:32] moved to Israel and their grandchildren,

[41:35] you know, have a right to be upset about

[41:37] that. Okay, got it. But those same

[41:39] people are committing genocide. So it

[41:40] was wrong when it happened to

[41:41] grandparents. It's wrong when they're

[41:42] doing it. It because it's just wrong.

[41:44] There are universal principles that if

[41:46] we don't defend, we will wind up in the

[41:49] world that we left when we started this

[41:51] country, which is the powerful people

[41:52] get to do whatever they want and

[41:53] everyone else has to just deal with it.

[41:55] And I don't want to live in that

[41:56] country.

[41:57] >> I agree with you when you say there's

[41:58] universal principles that we should just

[42:00] uphold and that obviously, you know,

[42:02] there are things that iniquitous acts

[42:04] that we should absolutely speak against

[42:05] no matter who it's for or against.

[42:07] Absolutely. I'm totally with you. The

[42:09] flip side to it, the the flip side to

[42:11] it, however, is that one could easily

[42:13] also argue that that lets off the hook

[42:16] those who have benefited and have

[42:19] positioned themselves to be in positions

[42:21] of power and influence where they can

[42:24] subjugate a vast majority of folks in

[42:27] our society as we've witnessed people

[42:29] doing for decades upon decades. You can

[42:31] make the argument that they're already

[42:33] at an advantage and they're getting left

[42:35] off the hook by doing exactly what

[42:37] Tucker Carlson suggests because what you

[42:39] want to do is start with a clean slate

[42:41] and just erase all that has happened. I

[42:43] don't mean literally erase it from the

[42:45] mind's eye. I'm just talking about

[42:46] starting from scratch and going forward

[42:48] when we can never start from scratch

[42:50] going forward. Tucker Carson, you know

[42:51] that.

[42:52] >> But but yeah, I mean look, this has been

[42:55] going on for over 60 years. I don't

[42:57] think it's actually helped that much.

[42:59] It's made people hate each other, but

[43:00] it's also obscuring the true crisis in

[43:04] the country, which has nothing to do

[43:06] with race and has to do with economics

[43:08] and the people benefiting from the

[43:10] private equity scams and the crypto

[43:11] scams and all the other scams underway

[43:13] in the American economy. We don't really

[43:15] produce anything. We just lend money at

[43:16] high interest, sell real estate again

[43:18] and again. Those people are getting

[43:20] richer than everyone else, the

[43:22] billionaire class, and they don't want

[43:24] to deal with questions about how exactly

[43:26] this works. Why are they paying half the

[43:27] taxes that you're paying as a wage

[43:29] earner? Like, I don't really get that.

[43:31] And they don't want to have to defend

[43:32] it. So instead, they're like, the real

[43:33] problem is race and these whites are

[43:36] just bad and they've taken all the

[43:38] stuff. Well, actually, if you look at

[43:40] the numbers, that's insane. One of the

[43:42] biggest groups of poor people in this

[43:44] country is white. Are they privileged? I

[43:45] don't think they are. So, like, it's not

[43:47] about race. We should treat all American

[43:50] citizens equally. That's the whole point

[43:53] of the civil rights movement. That's the

[43:54] whole point of the Constitution. and

[43:56] we're not and we should and then just

[43:57] say look it's not about ignoring the

[43:59] crimes of the past which we should not

[44:01] do. We should never lie about anything.

[44:03] It's just about being honest about

[44:05] what's actually happening and the real

[44:07] problems stem from the way our tax code

[44:10] is structured and most people don't even

[44:12] think about it because no one in the

[44:13] media ever talks about it.

[44:14] >> It's like really so if I invest money I

[44:17] pay half the tax rate as if I go to

[44:19] work. So, are we saying that it's twice

[44:22] as virtuous to invest or to get

[44:24] inherited money as it is to have a job?

[44:26] That's what we are saying because we tax

[44:28] things we want to discourage. That's why

[44:29] cigarettes are expensive. So, like, are

[44:32] you really going to say with a straight

[44:33] face that you're like twice as good a

[44:35] person because you inherited money as I

[44:37] am because I go to work every day?

[44:39] Because that's what we're saying,

[44:41] >> right?

[44:41] >> And so, in a normal country, you just

[44:42] like have a revolution. People like, I'm

[44:43] not putting up with this. But in our

[44:45] country, because our every conversation

[44:46] is controlled by the media filter, we

[44:49] don't even know what's happening. And so

[44:50] people are like, well, my life sucks. It

[44:52] must be the whites or and some whites

[44:54] are like, it must be the blacks or

[44:55] whatever. It's like this is racial

[44:58] fment. This is racial conflict which is

[45:00] created by the people who are taking all

[45:02] the money.

[45:03] >> Any whether anyone agrees or disagrees

[45:06] with you, I think especially me sitting

[45:08] here talking to you, I really really

[45:09] appreciate the fact that you're willing

[45:10] to tackle any issue and I'm thankful for

[45:12] that. So, thank you for the

[45:13] conversation. Let me let let me ask you

[45:16] this just a few more questions before I

[45:17] let you go.

[45:18] >> I I'm I'm thinking about the Nick

[45:20] Fuentes interview, for example. And I

[45:22] wanted to transition a little bit to

[45:24] this because, you know, I'm wondering

[45:26] about where the line uh is between

[45:29] exposing extremism and normalizing it

[45:32] when you have somebody like him that you

[45:35] had on your show. I remember people were

[45:37] criticizing you. I I didn't watch the

[45:39] interview. I saw, you know, clips of it,

[45:41] but I didn't watch the whole interview

[45:43] in its entirety. And I remember people

[45:45] accusing you of being quite soft on him,

[45:47] even though I can't imagine you being

[45:49] that guy, but that's what they were

[45:50] accusing you of. And they were saying

[45:51] stuff like that, but we know some of the

[45:53] things that people have felt he said and

[45:56] some of the positions that he has taken.

[45:58] From a generic perspective, extremism

[46:00] compared to normalization.

[46:02] Where does Tucker Carlson draw that line

[46:06] in the sand, particularly considering

[46:08] the position that you're in now and the

[46:10] kind of influence you wield?

[46:13] I think it's really important not to

[46:15] normalize extremism and to call it out

[46:18] by name and to say to just frame this

[46:21] correctly like what you're saying is

[46:23] crazy and extreme. I think it's super

[46:25] important to say that because otherwise

[46:26] it's like no, this is normal. And I

[46:28] think one of the most extreme human

[46:29] beings I've ever met in my entire life

[46:31] was Lindsey Graham. And I would say

[46:33] maybe the second most extreme I've ever

[46:34] met is Ted Cruz. Both US senators.

[46:36] Lindsey Graham unfortunately passed away

[46:38] recently. Ted Cruz still represents

[46:39] Texas. These are people who have called

[46:41] for murdering innocents at scale.

[46:44] Bombing people who did nothing wrong

[46:46] killing kids and have done that for like

[46:48] decades. Who have openly called for the

[46:52] US government and American citizens to

[46:55] be more loyal to a foreign country than

[46:56] to their own. who have called for

[46:58] banning Americans right to criticize a

[47:02] foreign country, eliminating free speech

[47:03] on behalf of a foreign nation. You can

[47:04] criticize your own country, totally

[47:06] fine. You're allowed to criticize a

[47:07] foreign country. That's so crazy that I

[47:09] can hardly believe it's happening and

[47:11] nobody says it. So you'll go and you'll

[47:12] interview Lindsey Graham or interview I

[47:14] interviewed Ted Cruz last year and

[47:16] people are like, "Oh, no one is like, I

[47:18] can't believe you're sitting with that

[47:20] wacko extremist Ted Cruz who's literally

[47:22] called for murdering people and by the

[47:24] way has helped murder people. He's a

[47:26] United States senator. He's not a

[47:27] podcaster. He votes for things. He

[47:29] appropriates money. That guy has blood

[47:32] on his hands. The blood of of countless

[47:34] innocents, but it's totally cool to sit

[47:36] with him. How does that work? I don't

[47:38] understand. Not one person has ever

[47:39] said, "I can't believe you sat across

[47:41] from Ted Cruz. He's a murderer." Which

[47:44] it's true, but we because we're so

[47:46] >> You're calling the You're calling a

[47:48] senator.

[47:49] Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Tuck. These

[47:51] are these are political officials you

[47:53] have known just like you've known Trump.

[47:54] You've known a lot of guys on Capitol

[47:56] Hill. You've interviewed a lot of them.

[47:57] You've talked to a lot of them. You used

[47:59] to be on Fox News with your top rated

[48:01] show at 800 PM after you succeeded Bill

[48:03] O'Reilly. You used to talk to these

[48:04] folks all the time. And now here you are

[48:06] on this show. You're calling you're

[48:09] calling them a mur you're calling

[48:12] Senator a guy like Senator Ted Cruz a

[48:14] murderer.

[48:15] >> Well, it's true. Ted Cruz is calling for

[48:17] the killing of innocents and funding it.

[48:19] And so what what I'm actually calling

[48:20] for is not calling out poor Ted Cruz

[48:22] who's suffering is already living in

[48:24] hell. And I'm not even mad at Ted Cruz.

[48:26] I'm I I want to awaken people to a real

[48:30] moral framework. So you have people who

[48:33] say ugly things and great, you know,

[48:36] that happens everywhere. I'm against

[48:37] saying ugly things. I try not to. I

[48:38] have. I try not to do that. But

[48:40] >> you just did. That's a very ugly thing

[48:42] to say, Tucker. I mean, to call a

[48:44] senator. It is. It's an ugly thing to

[48:46] say, Tucker. for first of all that first

[48:48] of all I don't I don't because he is a

[48:50] senator it actually matters. It's not

[48:52] ugly. It's a fact. Ted Cruz has called

[48:54] for killing innocents. He's done it to

[48:56] me many many many times. Well, just bomb

[48:58] them. Just bomb the whole city. Just

[49:00] blow them up. What? There are people,

[49:02] thousands, millions of people who live

[49:04] there who did nothing wrong. They have

[49:05] no role in this. They have no role in a

[49:07] nuclear program. They're just going to

[49:08] work. They're little kids. That's crazy.

[49:12] That is extremist behavior. And he has

[49:14] the power to make it happen. He's a US

[49:16] senator. So, by the way, we should get

[49:18] back in the media into the habit of

[49:20] criticizing the powerful. And I know

[49:22] everyone's upset about some 27year-old

[49:25] gay kid, Nick Fuentes. Oh, he says

[49:27] naughty things. Yeah, I agree. Whatever.

[49:29] But who cares? What we should care about

[49:31] is when powerful people misuse their

[49:33] power to hurt the innocent. And Ted Cruz

[49:35] is doing that. And so are a lot of other

[49:36] senators. So, I'm just waiting for

[49:37] someone to call me and be like, I can't

[49:39] believe you platform Ted Cruz.

[49:42] >> I can't believe how how do you live with

[49:43] your Do you sleep at night? Mhm.

[49:45] >> I mean, did you shake his hand? The hand

[49:47] of someone who called for the murder of

[49:49] innocents. I can't believe you can live

[49:50] with yourself. I'm waiting for that

[49:52] moment. It'll never come because

[49:53] everyone's so freaking brainwashed that

[49:55] they think that whatever that little gay

[49:57] kid is the is the threat.

[49:59] >> I've seen you talking to Megan Kelly.

[50:01] I've heard Candace Owens position and

[50:04] she talked about fearing for her life.

[50:07] Where are you right now? I'm talking

[50:10] about psychologically. Are do you find

[50:13] yourself sitting back concerned for your

[50:16] well-being considering the positions

[50:18] that you've taken and the dare I say

[50:21] enemies you may have provoked?

[50:25] >> Well, I mean, where am I right now? I'm

[50:26] in a bunker hundreds of feet.

[50:28] >> I don't mean I don't mean where. I'm not

[50:29] asking where cuz I don't want I don't

[50:31] want you to tell your location. I don't

[50:32] want you to tell your I'm just talking

[50:34] psychologically. I'm saying where are

[50:36] you right now? Candace Owens has been on

[50:39] the record talking about she thinks they

[50:40] they may try to take her out. Who knows

[50:43] what others like Megan Kelly are

[50:45] thinking. Where are what is your

[50:47] thinking? Where are you right now in

[50:49] light of the things that you said, the

[50:51] conversations and the dialogues you've

[50:54] provoked and how you've incited enemies

[50:57] against you?

[51:00] Well, I from my perspective, I told the

[51:01] truth and some people didn't like it

[51:02] because it was inconvenient to them. But

[51:04] I would say all of, you know, if you

[51:06] live to a certain age, and you have, I

[51:08] think we're like the same age,

[51:09] >> you, you know, you see people you love

[51:10] die and you know, people who were

[51:14] totally fine one day and they're gone

[51:15] the next and it's incredibly sad. It's

[51:17] the saddest thing, but it's also a

[51:19] reminder that we're not in charge of our

[51:20] lives. We're not in control. And you

[51:22] think you have forever, you don't. You

[51:23] have a certain time. You can't control

[51:24] that. And so every day, this is sounds

[51:27] like a bumper sticker, but it's real.

[51:28] Every day really is a gift. We don't

[51:30] treat it that way. It's just like, oh,

[51:30] it's another day. No, no, it's a gift.

[51:33] And we don't know how many days we have

[51:34] left. None not one of us does. It

[51:36] doesn't matter how old or young you are.

[51:38] Not one of us knows how many we have

[51:40] left. And so I've just lived long enough

[51:42] to really believe that because I've seen

[51:43] it. I mean, Charlie Kirk was sitting at

[51:44] the table I'm sitting at now not long

[51:46] before he was killed. And then he's

[51:47] gone. Never thought that would happen. I

[51:49] still feel so sad about it as I do for

[51:51] all the people I've lost over the years.

[51:53] I'm sure you feel the same way. So yes,

[51:55] >> the idea that like, oh, I'm in, you

[51:57] know, in under threat. Well, we're all

[51:59] under threat all the time because we

[52:01] don't know what the future is. So, just

[52:02] like stop worrying about that you can't

[52:04] control it. This is I really believe

[52:06] this. Stop worrying all the time about

[52:08] stuff you can't control. And instead

[52:10] focus as intently as you can on loving

[52:13] the people around you, telling the

[52:14] truth, trying to do the right thing,

[52:16] knowing you're going to make a ton of

[52:17] mistakes doing it. Like that's that's

[52:18] the business of life, I think.

[52:20] >> Tucker Tucker, the word love comes

[52:22] associated with hope in the eyes of a

[52:24] lot of people, and you've used that word

[52:27] a lot in this conversation that you and

[52:29] I have just had. I'm wondering when we

[52:32] think about hope,

[52:34] is there a light at the end of the

[52:36] tunnel? Is there some hope? When I look

[52:37] at the Democratic party, I look at

[52:39] Governor Josh Shapiro out of

[52:40] Pennsylvania. I look at Governor West

[52:42] Moore out of Maryland. I see Governor

[52:44] Gavin Newsome out of California trying

[52:46] to gain traction. We've heard about

[52:48] Bashier out of Kentucky. We know Rubio

[52:51] and Vance are in the mix with the GOP.

[52:54] We've seen Governor DeSantis and his

[52:56] leadership in Florida, even though I

[52:58] might have a couple of issues with him.

[53:01] Where are you in terms of candidates

[53:04] that exist on either side of the aisle?

[53:07] Is there a ray of hope anywhere that you

[53:10] see it based on what you've observed

[53:14] over the last 18 months or so?

[53:16] >> Boy, I mean, it's just Waltz of the

[53:19] Pygmies. As you were reading those

[53:21] names, I know a lot of those guys. I

[53:22] just I just had this image in my mind of

[53:25] the Wizard of Oz and all the dwarves

[53:26] like we represent the Lollipop Guild.

[53:28] Like it's such a collection of

[53:30] mediocrities. I'm sure they're not all

[53:31] bad people. Um I'm guessing, but I'm

[53:35] sure they're not. But none of those

[53:38] people is going to save this country or

[53:40] make your life bad. I mean, honestly,

[53:42] let's be real. I'm not sure that there

[53:44] are political solutions right now. We

[53:46] could have better politics, people who

[53:48] care about us. But the truth is our

[53:50] problems are are really significant, but

[53:53] it doesn't mean that our lives have to

[53:54] be barren or bleak because really your

[53:57] life is not about who's in office. This

[54:00] is what I've learned recent. I've

[54:01] thought a lot of this recently because I

[54:02] was so disappointed in Trump and I'm

[54:04] like, "Oh my gosh, what do we do?" And

[54:06] it's like, I don't know, love your wife

[54:08] more. Be kinder to the people who work

[54:09] for you. Give a 100% tip at dinner. I

[54:11] mean, I don't know. Like you don't have

[54:13] to wait for some savior to come and make

[54:16] everything perfect because like Josh

[54:18] Shapiro or Dantis, I mean come on these

[54:21] guys. I'm not saying they're evil or

[54:23] anything. I'm sure they're fine, but

[54:24] like they have no freaking idea what

[54:26] they're doing. They have no power. The

[54:28] president doesn't have as much power as

[54:30] we thought. That's another thing I

[54:31] learned. He can't fix all these

[54:32] problems. He doesn't have He can't even

[54:34] He can't even do Well, then why the hell

[54:37] do you want me or somebody else to run

[54:39] for office? I mean, what hope would we

[54:40] have based on what

[54:42] >> Well, you would have no hope, but how

[54:43] hilarious would that be? Stephen A.

[54:45] Smith, ladies and gentlemen. Go Stephen

[54:47] A. Smith. And you'd be like,

[54:49] >> you know, I think I couldn't get

[54:51] anything done. [laughter] I'd lose my

[54:53] damn mind dealing with them on Capitol

[54:55] Hill. I couldn't get anything done.

[54:57] >> But we don't have to wait for that. I

[54:59] guess that's the point. I mean, I've

[55:00] really had to brood on this recently cuz

[55:02] I convinced myself that Trump was really

[55:04] going to make a huge difference. And by

[55:05] the way, it didn't have to be this bad.

[55:07] Obviously, it was his fault. But he was

[55:10] never going to fix all the problems

[55:12] because that's kind of not how it works.

[55:15] Like the president doesn't have the

[55:16] power to do that. I don't have to wait

[55:17] for the perfect guy or even a great guy

[55:19] to get elected to make my own life

[55:21] better, to make the lives of people

[55:22] around me better. And I shouldn't wait.

[55:24] And I shouldn't also think that my

[55:27] happiness

[55:28] it, you know, is dependent on who's in

[55:31] the White House. Like that's just not

[55:33] true. It's like part of the op.

[55:36] You know, you can create beautiful

[55:38] things and a beautiful life and love

[55:40] other people no matter who is. I mean,

[55:42] there are happy people in North Korea.

[55:44] I'm sorry. I've been there. It's true.

[55:46] >> Very last question. Is that something

[55:48] you've all you've always known or is it

[55:51] something you've learned since you

[55:53] departed from Fox News? Since you built

[55:55] your own company, since you're doing

[55:56] what you're doing now?

[55:58] >> I mean, I've learned it. I mean, if

[56:00] you'd asked me 30 years ago, do I think

[56:03] any man can save humanity? No, I mean,

[56:06] I've never really believed it, but I've

[56:08] sort of talked myself into it. Look, you

[56:09] spend enough time around politics,

[56:10] you've had this experience, and you're

[56:12] like, it's so important that so and so

[56:14] win or more more commonly, it's so

[56:16] important that person lose. Like, Kla

[56:19] Harris is going to destroy everything.

[56:20] And like, I wouldn't vote for Kla

[56:22] Harris. It's kind of a joke, but but

[56:24] that's not really true. She's not going

[56:25] to like destroy the love between me and

[56:27] my wife. You know what I mean? Like,

[56:30] there are some things that just politics

[56:32] doesn't touch and and will never touch.

[56:35] and those things like what happens after

[56:37] you die. I don't think Donald Trump is

[56:39] in charge of that. And so the tragedy of

[56:42] this war and the sadness and the

[56:45] betrayal and the shock that I felt being

[56:47] close to it and close to Trump was an

[56:50] occasion for me to think through some of

[56:52] these things and like be honest with

[56:53] myself. Like I think I was putting a

[56:55] little bit too much on Trump. Did I

[56:57] really think that electing Trump over

[57:00] Kamla was going to make all the

[57:01] difference forever? Like if I thought

[57:03] that I'm an idiot. I mean, it probably

[57:05] be better, I guess, but it's not. If I

[57:07] think that's like salvation, that's on

[57:09] me.

[57:11] >> Tucker Carlson, appreciate the time,

[57:13] man. Gave me a lot of time. Thank you so

[57:15] much. I owe you I owe you an interview.

[57:17] Uh,

[57:17] >> dude, I'm going to see you on the debate

[57:19] stage. I'll be in the front with a press

[57:21] badge cheering you on. Good luck.

[57:23] >> You just Listen, nobody has dissuaded me

[57:25] more so than you. You already told me

[57:26] you ain't gonna [laughter] get anything

[57:27] done anyway. Why bother? There we go.

[57:30] Oh,

[57:30] >> Tucker Carlson, appreciate your time,

[57:32] man. Thank you so much. See you. Thank

[57:34] you.