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Candace Owens and Rabbi Shmuley Boteach Clash Over Israel-Hamas War, Anti-Semitism Allegations, and Michael Jackson
Candace Owens and Rabbi Shmuley Boteach engage in a heated debate on Piers Morgan Uncensored about the Israel-Hamas war, accusations of anti-Semitism, and claims of radical Zionism. The conversation exposes deep divisions over Gaza casualties, Jewish-Christian relations, and allegations ranging from Holocaust denial to pedophilia harboring. What began as a discussion about Israel's military response descended into personal attacks, Biblical references, and accusations of lies and incitement. Both claim to represent their communities while the other engages in hatred, revealing the explosive tension surrounding Israel criticism in American public discourse.
An Explosive Confrontation on Piers Morgan Uncensored
Piers Morgan brought together two of the most controversial voices in the Israel-Palestine debate: Candace Owens, host of the Candace podcast, and Rabbi Shmuley Boteach, author of The Israel Warrior. The debate, intended to address the Israel-Hamas war, anti-Semitism, and American involvement in Israel, quickly descended into accusations of lies, incitement, and hatred. Morgan established ground rules for equal speaking time and discouraged ad hominem attacks, though he acknowledged that with these two guests, he could make no promises.
The debate occurred against the backdrop of the Israel-Hamas war approaching its grim anniversary, a conflict that Morgan noted has changed how many people think about the historic dispute and Israel's role in the modern world. Never before has there been such active debate about whether the United States and its allies should back Israel, with protests bringing both anti-Semitism and accusations that sometimes insulate Israel from criticism.
Rabbi Shmuley's Opening: Accusations of Anti-Black and Anti-Semitic Rhetoric
Rabbi Shmuley opened by stating he has spent his life bringing together the black and Jewish communities, emphasizing their shared history of persecution and spiritual promise. He then launched into what Morgan later described as a four-minute personal attack against Candace Owens, calling her "simultaneously the foremost anti-black rhetorician in all of the United States and the foremost anti-semite in America."
The rabbi claimed the Jewish community has begun calling her "Candace Ovens" because of what he characterized as "Goebbels-style rhetoric against Jews." He accused Owens of saying Jews are "nearly all pedophiles," that Israel was set up as a haven for pedophiles, and that Judaism is a "demonic satanic cult." He also referenced her "absolute obsession with Jewish sexuality and Jewish genitalia," specifically mentioning her comments about Brigitte Macron, the first lady of France.
Rabbi Shmuley further alleged that Owens claimed Jews killed JFK because he was about to ostracize Israel, and that her rhetoric leads to violence against Jews. He revealed that one week prior to the debate, he was swatted at his home, with five police cars breaking into his house after Mayor Michael Wilds of Englewood, New Jersey received an email arguably from one of Owens' followers. The FBI is now investigating, he claimed.
He concluded his opening by questioning Owens' Christianity, asking whether calling him "filth" constitutes loving one's enemies or turning the other cheek as Jesus taught. "If you are a Christian then I am the second coming of Christ," he declared.
Candace Owens Responds: Radical Judaism and Jewish Supremacism
Owens began her response by dismissing the need to address the personal attacks, stating that "one of the things that plausibly unites people across all religions Muslims Jews Christians is that we all recognize that Rabbi Shmuley is unhinged." She described him as "mentally in my view unwell," clarifying this wasn't an attack but a reality because she's never seen someone "make things up out of thin air that were never said."
She noted that black people will never accept Rabbi Shmuley after Michael Jackson put him on a list of people who he felt were ruining his life. Owens then pivoted to her central argument: that radical fringe sects exist within every religion, and "radical Judaism is also a thing." She pointed to Rabbi Shmuley's 2016 Facebook tribute to Rabbi Menachem Schneerson, whom he called his mentor and friend.
Owens explained that Schneerson's followers, some of whom believe he was and is the Messiah, were recently in the news for digging tunnels in Brooklyn and hurling benches at police officers. She cited the work of two Jewish professors, Israel Shahak and Norton Mezvinsky, whose book "Jewish Fundamentalism in Israel" translated Schneerson's teachings. According to their translation, Schneerson described the difference between a Jew and a non-Jew, stating: "The body of a Jewish person is of totally different quality from the body of all nations of the world... the difference in quality is so different and so great that the body should be considered completely different species."
Owens argued that Rabbi Shmuley believes in this Jewish supremacism, and that it's incumbent upon the Jewish community to call out their radicals just as she has called out Black Lives Matter and black supremacism. She stated she is "on equal footing" because she does not support supremacism whether it's coming from her community or the Jewish community. The entire world is now wondering, she said, whether Israel has a radical fringe government, and many are concluding the answer is yes.
The Israel-Hamas War and Netanyahu's Failing Mission
Morgan attempted to steer the debate toward the actual war, asking Rabbi Shmuley whether Netanyahu's mission statement is failing given that people inside Israel are now coming after the prime minister, angry that his mission to save the hostages is not working. Six more hostages were executed over the weekend, and relatives are demanding the government bring back the hostages before it's too late.
Rabbi Shmuley initially refused to answer, instead pointing out that Morgan didn't object when Owens called him "mentally unhinged" after Morgan had criticized the rabbi for his four-minute personal attack on Owens. When Morgan pressed him again, the rabbi finally addressed the question but not before bringing up Lord Michael Farmer, Owens' father-in-law.
The rabbi noted that Lord Farmer, a British peer, issued "one of the most robust and beautiful defenses of Israel" since October 7th. Farmer had stated that while there are terrible Palestinian casualties and God loves every Palestinian child as much as a Jewish child, Israel has no choice but to fight because Hamas hides in residential areas and under nurseries. The savagery of October 7th demands a response, and Israel is doing exactly the right thing, according to Lord Farmer's statement.
Rabbi Shmuley characterized Farmer's statement as showing "contempt" for his daughter-in-law because he referred to her as "a high-profile member of his family" without naming her or saying he loves her. The rabbi compared the British memory of Hitler, the Battle of Britain, and V1 and V2 rockets to the current situation, then accused Owens of saying "the Nazis were the good guys and it was the Allies the British people who engaged in the ethnic cleansing of 12 million people."
On the hostage situation, Rabbi Shmuley explained that Israelis in the streets are not saying to stop the war but rather calling for a ceasefire to release the hostages because Israel is a "culture of life." He noted that Israel previously traded 1,000 murderers, including Yahya Sinwar (whom Israel saved at Soroka Hospital when he had a brain tumor), for Gilad Shalit. Some Israelis now want their children home even if it leads to another October 7th, but no one is saying to stop destroying Hamas.
Lord Farmer's Statement and Family Dynamics
Morgan asked Owens about her father-in-law's public statement. She expressed gratitude that Rabbi Shmuley brought it up because she found it "very disturbing" to see him "try to pretend that my father-in-law distanced from me or said something in favor of anything that Rabbi Shmuley is saying."
Owens clarified that within any family there are disagreements, but fundamentally it's all love. She noted that prior to her father-in-law posting the statement, she had just returned from vacation with him literally 48 hours earlier. She described it as "incredibly demonic" for someone to try to use the Bible and then immediately follow it up by "trying to pull a family apart."
She questioned whether such behavior is "utterly unholy" and pivoted to discussing what she considers relevant to the conversation: holiness. Prior to October 7th, she said, most people including herself simply said Israel is our friend and ally without much engagement. Post-October 7th, Zionists in media demanded everyone pay attention, but when people began paying attention, "we didn't like what we saw."
The Gaza Death Toll and Dresden Comparison
Owens stated that no one can tell her to feel comfortable with 18,000 children being "ruthlessly murdered" or with more explosives being dropped on Gaza than were dropped on Hiroshima. She noted that Gaza is 30 miles long and 7 miles wide with an incredibly dense population, and according to Haaretz, 40,000 Palestinians have been murdered.
She referenced Isaiah 5:20: "Woe unto them that call evil good and good evil that put darkness for light and light for darkness." She then quoted Revelation 3:9: "Behold I will make them of the synagogue of Satan which say they are Jews and are not but do lie." Speaking directly to Rabbi Shmuley, she said people can see and hear evil, and what he is doing is "an act of evil." The lies he tells not just about her but about her family members are "a good example for the world to see what we are referring to when we call something radical Zionism."
Rabbi Shmuley challenged Owens' claim about dropping more bombs on Gaza than Hiroshima, noting that Hiroshima was an atomic bomb and Israel has nuclear weapons it has never used. He stated that Israel admits to a one-to-one civilian-to-combatant ratio of casualties, which he called a tragedy but noted that Hamas fires rockets from nurseries. He compared this to other conflicts: the United States in Afghanistan had a 4-to-1 ratio, the Korean War was 5-to-1, and Iraq was at least 2-to-1. Israel has the lowest per capita ratio of combatants to civilians, he argued.
Morgan interjected that there is a unique demographic in Gaza where half of the 2 million people are under 18, which is very different from the scenarios Rabbi Shmuley cited. This has caused international outcry because so many children have been killed in the civilian death count. Morgan acknowledged that Hamas has embedded itself in civilian territory and built tunnels, but the collateral damage to thousands of children has tested the patience of the world.
The debate then focused on the Dresden comparison. Rabbi Shmuley brought up that Winston Churchill was told by Americans not to bomb German cities at night because precision couldn't be maintained, but Churchill said his pilots were more important and flattened German cities. He is still considered the greatest British statesman of the 20th century.
Morgan noted that the flattening of cities like Dresden was widely condemned at the time, including by many in Britain, and led to the establishment of the Geneva Convention after World War II specifically to stop that kind of thing from happening again. When asked if she condemns Winston Churchill as a war criminal for Dresden, Owens said "absolutely not" because Churchill saved the world from Adolf Hitler and the Nazis.
Morgan asked why not, given that she just said the bombing was wrong. Owens clarified that Churchill was not a war criminal, leading the rabbi to say "Israel is saving the Middle East from Hamas Islamic Jihad Iran." Owens responded that Israel is not doing that, prompting Morgan to interject.
The Dresden Statistics Debate
Owens stated that Dresden was considered a holocaust and a war crime, and it was "absolutely horrific that a bunch of Christians" on the eve of Ash Wednesday were reduced to ashes. She argued that referencing a war crime to justify what's happening in Gaza is not a point in the rabbi's favor. The logic of saying "look at all these other horrific things we did why do you care about this horrible thing" makes no sense to her.
She stated there is no person in good conscience who should be comfortable with the amount of death happening in Gaza, and if correlating it to Dresden, that would be a fair comparison "except much more has been dropped on Gaza than was dropped in Dresden." She asked if it's fair to call what's happening in Gaza a holocaust given the non-stop onslaught.
Owens clarified that the collective punishment being assigned to the Gazan people is unacceptable and the entire world should condemn it. She believes a radical fringe has taken hold of Israel. She noted that people are not even allowed to critique Israel without people like Rabbi Shmuley trying to bully them. Zionist organizations are threatening and bullying people, trying to get them fired. The Zionist Federation of Australia asked for her visa to be banned simply because she doesn't support what Israel is doing.
Rabbi Shmuley asked for her source on the Dresden comparison. Owens looked it up and found that 70,000 tons of explosives were dropped on Gaza according to CNN, while 2,700 tons of bombs were dropped on Dresden in an 800 bomber air raid according to Britannica. The rabbi objected that she was comparing an 11-month war to a single night in Dresden, but Morgan clarified that what Owens said was true: the Israel Defense Force had dropped more bombs on Gaza than were dropped on Dresden overall.
The rabbi claimed Owens made the statement without knowing what she was talking about and called it a "blood libel." Morgan asked if he accepts that more bombs were dropped on Gaza than Dresden, and the rabbi said he found the debate "astonishing," questioning whether it's a "serious show" and objecting that Owens had to use her computer to look up facts during the debate.
The October 7th Attack and Civilian Casualties
Rabbi Shmuley emphasized that Israel was attacked "in the most savage way" with women gang raped and their breasts cut off. He accused Owens of having a guest who denies women were raped and noted she recently said the New York Times lied about mass rape of women, yet now suddenly likes the New York Times when it supports her point about Gaza bombing tonnage.
He called himself "the number one critic of the New York Times in America" and noted a pattern where Owens says there's no racism in America but then sued the Stamford Connecticut Board of Education for a $40,000 settlement against racism. She then fabricated that it wasn't a settlement but was for tutors, he claimed, asking which tutors are paid $40,000 per month.
The rabbi also objected that Owens says he has no right to bring up her family while she can bring up Brigitte Macron and Emmanuel Macron, "destroy their marriage," and obsess about the first lady of France. Morgan had challenged her on this previously. The rabbi noted that the day after October 7th, Owens said nothing for days and never condemned it, and when asked on Morgan's show, she said she never talks about anything international. Yet she can speak about the genitals of the first lady of France for months but not the gang rape of Jewish women.
Why So Many Consider Candace Owens Anti-Semitic
Morgan asked Owens why so many people in the Jewish community believe she is anti-Semitic. She called it "a very good question" and explained that the media as an entity has been "mining Jewish pain" by taking people out of context and presenting things as fact that are simply untrue.
Owens compared it to what was done to black Americans regarding her stance on Black Lives Matter. The media made black people believe she "legitimately hated being black and hated the color of my skin" because she stood against BLM as an organization. When the media lies, people accept what they're reading as true, but she didn't hate black Americans—she hated BLM abusing and mining black pain, using slavery as a distraction from what was ultimately a fraudulent organization bringing more harm to black Americans.
She feels the same way about the state of Israel, believing it will yield more anti-Semitism and make people associate what Prime Minister Netanyahu is doing with all Jews around the world. It's the same tactics of manipulation, name-calling, and ad hominem attacks not based in fact or reality but based on not wanting to answer fair critiques about what Israel is doing.
The Hitler Nationalism Clip
Rabbi Shmuley went through what he called Owens' "history of anti-Semitism." He claimed that when she said in 2018 she has no issue with Hitler because he was a nationalist who only became a problem when he went beyond borders, the Jewish community still didn't call her anti-Semitic because they gave her a pass. He argued this was absurd because Hitler's domestic policy by then included the Nuremberg laws and Kristallnacht on November 9, 1938, when 3,000 synagogues were burned in a single night.
Morgan played the actual clip where Owens was discussing nationalism and globalism. In it, she explained she doesn't have a problem with the word nationalism, which gets poisoned by elitists who want globalism. When people think of nationalism in America, they think of Hitler, who was a national socialist. She said, "If Hitler just wanted to make Germany great and have things run well, okay fine. The problem is that he wanted, he had dreams outside of Germany. He wanted to globalize."
After the clip, Owens explained she was at the Royal Automobile Club in the UK with Jewish journalists in the room, and nothing was written about it until months later when somebody was working on a hit piece. She was answering a question about how to embrace nationalism when it has a "dirty feel." She was saying she doesn't have an issue with nationalism and thinks it's fine to be a British or American nationalist. The problem is the word is wrongly attributed to Adolf Hitler, and she would argue he wasn't actually a nationalist because he invaded Poland and went beyond German borders. She didn't mention Jewish people or the Holocaust.
Rabbi Shmuley responded that Hitler's domestic policy included Kristallnacht burning down 3,000 synagogues in a single night domestically, the 1934 Nuremberg laws, and a complete dictatorship where he destroyed the Bundestag and created the SS under Himmler. He said even then the Jewish community gave her a pass and explained it as one mistake.
Holocaust Denial and Joseph Mengele Allegations
Rabbi Shmuley claimed Owens is going to be barred from Australia not because of anything she said about Israel but because she's a "Holocaust denier." He said a 100-year-old victim of Josef Mengele's experiments came forward saying Owens would traumatize her all over again. Owens "actually said that Mengele's experiments, the fourth worst person in Nazi Germany after Hitler, Himmler, Goebbels, were a fabrication."
Morgan asked Owens two direct questions: Are you a Holocaust denier or do you accept six million Jews were killed by the Nazis in the Holocaust? And do you believe Josef Mengele did what he is reported to have done?
Owens answered: "Absolutely I am not a Holocaust denier. This is again another fabrication." She explained this was based on a monologue where she put pressure on the American government to explain why, after learning about horrific things Nazi scientists did, the CIA via Operation Paperclip took Nazi scientists and brought them to America where they continued horrific experiments on Americans. That was the full context.
She said critics pulled out one sentence where she said "we've heard all of these sorts of things that they've done, you know, cut people in half, sewed them back together, and I said that sounds like a ridiculous waste of time." When pulled by itself, it sounds like she's diminishing stories, but in reality she's saying let's take everything at face value—why would the American government bring these scientists to America? She clarified that Dr. Mengele was not one of the scientists brought to America.
Morgan asked for clarity: Do you accept the Nazis murdered six million Jews in the Holocaust? Owens replied she has never once in any appearance denied the Holocaust atrocities ever. Do you accept Josef Mengele was a despicable man who perpetrated horrendous crimes including experimenting on people? She answered that all Nazi experiments were horrific, which is why she was questioning why the American government would bring over Nazi scientists who became part of the CIA and continued experiments on Americans through the 1960s and beyond during the Korean War.
Theodore Herzl and the Pedophilia Accusations
Rabbi Shmuley stated this was "a complete and utter fabrication" and promised to post clips after the debate. He claimed Owens said she doubts any of the Mengele experiments happened because they were "a waste of time," and "the whole Holocaust was a waste of time." He argued that hatred is so self-destructive that Hitler had no winter equipment for his soldiers at Stalingrad because boxcars were taking Jews to Auschwitz.
He then raised that Owens said Theodore Herzl was a Frankist, and when she attacks Frankists as Jewish pedophiles, she forgets to mention they all converted to Catholicism in 1757. She said Herzl set up the state of Israel as a refuge for pedophiles, he claimed. This was before Gaza, before Rafah—she always refers to Jews as pedophiles as the main word she uses.
The rabbi connected this to the blood libel that began in 1099 with the First Crusade, where Jews were falsely accused of taking a Christian child and drinking his blood. He claimed Owens believes this and said Christian bodies were found all over Europe. On Catholic pedophilia, he noted that in 2002 Pope John Paul II recognized Israel and apologized, saying at least 2% of Catholic priests were pedophiles. Pope Benedict XVI raised it to 4%, and Pope Francis probably even higher to 6%. Almost a million children in France alone were abused by Catholic priests according to the French government, but Owens has never once condemned Catholic pedophilia even though it was the biggest scandal in the world.
Owens responded that on her show she spoke extensively about Frankists and told people there was a conversion into the Catholic faith. One thing she believes is that all Abrahamic religions have been infiltrated by satanists. Critics decided to pull apart only the piece where she's talking about Judaism, not where she's speaking about all faiths being infiltrated. It's important for everyone to recognize this satanic cult operating within all faiths that uses Christians, Jews, and Muslims.
She stated you'd be hard-pressed to find a Catholic who would defend pedophilia in any capacity. Regarding Judaism being filled with pedophiles, she called that "objectively nonsense" because as a Christian she's aware the first five books of her Bible are the Torah, so that would mean she's insinuating the first five books of her Bible are inspired by pedophilia, which is "absolutely false."
What she actually said is that it's a fact that Jewish American pedophiles escape and run and hide in Israel where they are given safe harbor by the government. Israel will not extradite American pedophiles despite the many billions of dollars the US gives Israel. She can't imagine a single person who would think it's not wrong that "we can't get back the men that are raping children." She clarified it wasn't Candace Owens who researched this but an incredible Jewish organization that looked into it, talked about how wrong it was, and brought it into mainstream media.
Rabbi Shmuley called this "an absolute lie and fabrication against Israel." He brought up the most famous example in Australia of a Jewish pedophile: Malka Leifer, a religious woman from Melbourne who apparently abused 74 children. She ran to Israel, was prosecuted by Israel, extradited, and "she is in Australia being prosecuted right now." This is a total fabrication, he said, and comes down to Owens having "the most unhealthy obsession with Jewish sexuality."
He noted that everyone knows the Vatican took cardinals like the Cardinal Archbishop of Boston and gave them the highest positions, but Owens has never criticized that, only Israel.
Morgan asked Owens point-blank if she said Theodore Herzl set up Israel as a haven for Jewish pedophiles. She first wanted to debunk the rabbi's claim that what she said was a lie. It is in CBS News, and the organization was Jewish Community Watch, an American organization that tracks accused pedophiles who has been trying for years to find a specific pedophile. They brought this to the forefront and CBS News partnered with them.
When the rabbi asked for the pedophile's name, Owens attempted to say it for the third time: Jimmy Julius Karow. The CBS News article title is "How Jewish American Pedophiles Hide from Justice in Israel." CBS News teamed up with a Jewish organization and came to this conclusion because courageous Jewish people brought it to the forefront.
Criticism of Israel Versus Anti-Semitism
Morgan noted there's some validity to the argument that too often people are immediately branded anti-Semitic if they dare to criticize the Israeli government, but there's a very big difference between criticizing a government and its actions versus a whole people, which is what anti-Semitism is. He asked if Rabbi Shmuley accepts that difference.
The rabbi responded that the beauty of Israel is it's a democracy. Hundreds of thousands are marching against Netanyahu, and he welcomes those protests because they show that even during war—just as in 1864 when the United States had a presidential election during the Civil War—Israel is the same.
Morgan pressed the specific point: Is it perfectly possible and indeed should it be a central tenet of robust democratic society that Israel's government and prime minister should be criticized by anyone who chooses without being branded anti-Semitic? Rabbi Shmuley agreed: "Of course." He said he is a very close friend of Netanyahu and criticizes him for allowing Qatar, "one of the most duplicitous evil governments in the world," to house billionaire Hamas leaders. He criticized Netanyahu for allowing money to go into Hamas believing they could be bought off. He criticized the Israeli government for not recognizing the Armenian Genocide, "something that Candace Owens blames the Jews" for, claiming she says Kamal Ataturk was led by Jews to commit the Armenian Genocide. He noted the genocide took place under the Ottoman Turks, not Ataturk, showing "she has no sense of history and just fabricates."
Final Statements: Can Religious People Say Something Nice?
Morgan noted they were getting sidetracked into pedophilia obsession when this debate was supposed to be about the war. He wanted to end by giving both an opportunity as religious people—every religion purports to be peace-loving and spread peace, harmony, love, respect, and kindness whether Catholic, Jewish, or otherwise—to say something nice about each other.
Owens said she "deeply appreciates Rabbi Shmuley having a platform." It's not something she's said she wants stripped away because he does more in terms of revealing what she's speaking about regarding radicalism than anybody else. In that way she's grateful he has a platform and would never call for him to be banned from anywhere. She hopes he gets a megaphone.
Morgan asked if she sees any saving grace as a human being in Rabbi Shmuley. She said she will pray for him and pray for his conversion into Christianity. She doesn't think it's normal to lie like that and feel nothing, but he continues to do it, filing FBI reports against her over pizza. She doesn't have any hatred in her heart toward him and hopes he forever has a platform because it showcases to the world what she's speaking about regarding radical Zionism.
Rabbi Shmuley said Owens "is gifted by God with incredible eloquence" and he thinks she can repent and cease being a force for hatred against the black community who call her "Candace Ovens" and have rejected her utterly. She is "one of the most despised women in America by the black community." She's doing a whole new tour to be re-accepted. He thinks she can use her eloquence to apologize.
Instead, he said, she essentially hinted the only reason she attacked the black community for the past four years—calling them stupid and dumb, saying they can't vote for themselves and cry wolf about racism—was because she was forced to do so at the Daily Wire, which he called "the Daily Lie." Maybe that's correct, but she should take personal responsibility. Saying Israel was created as a haven for Jewish pedophiles by Theodore Herzl is not the way to repent, nor is defending Kanye West when he says he loves Hitler. Hitler killed 10,000 Jews a day, "three 9/11s a day for four years between 1941 and 1945."
He concluded that he thinks she could use her eloquence to repent. Finally, if Owens could come forward and admit that as a Christian, Jesus said clearly you cannot approach him except through the Jews—he said the Jews are the root and Christians are the branch—the fact that the Jewish community considers her the number one anti-Semite in America means she cannot relate to Jesus. He encouraged her to become a Christian, calling it "a very nice thing to say." Jesus said "I am sent only to the lost sheep of Israel," so she should learn about the Jewish Jesus. He offered to give her a free copy of his book "Kosher Jesus" which teaches about the Jewish Jesus who said the meek shall inherit the earth, love your enemies, turn the other cheek. But she should stop calling him a killer and stop saying he's trying to kill her.
Morgan established that Rabbi Shmuley was struggling to find anything nice to say about Candace but appreciated both of them coming on together for what he called a very illuminating debate.
Video Transcript
behold I will make them of the synagogue of Satan which say they are Jews and are not but do lie and I'm speaking directly to you Rabbi Shi you have the Jewish Community beginning to call her not Candace Owens but Candice ovens people can see and hear evil and what you are doing right now is an act of evil we all recognize that Rabbi schmi is unhinged kandace stens never met Michael Jackson I was his Rabbi for 2 years she said that I killed him that she would say the Jews killed Michael Jackson said that I threatened to murder you I never said that you threatened to murder me don't cut me off I did not cut you off now she's factchecking it you're kidding me right I don't I don't have a computer on me these ready Defense Force had dropped more bombs on Gaza then were dropped on Dresden that is true you accept that Rabbi schi you know you you know P Pierce I find this an astonishing debate you ask I I wa wait wait first of all I first of all first of all I don't wait wait what do you mean it's true because she said it's true the war in Gaza is barreling towards a grim anniversary this deadly year spot by a terrorist atrocity and met with an often merciless response has changed the way that many people think about an historic dispute never in our lifetimes has there been such active debate about Israel's role in the modern world and whether the United States and its allies should back it protest and counter-protests that brought anti-Semitism to the four along with a charge that sometimes insulates Israel from criticism my next two guests have vivid opinions on these big issues and have had a very public Feud we're bringing them together for what we intend I hope to be a proper debate the topics will be the Israel Hamas War anti-Semitism in public life American involvement in Israel and Israeli involvement in the United States and we'll even talk about Michael Jackson who is relevant to this debate both guests will get roughly equal speaking time and a chance to question each other speaking of the other guests is not encouraged ad hom attacks are strongly discouraged but knowing these two as I do I can make no promises returning to uncensored host of the Candice podcast Candice Owens and the author of the Israel Warrior and the Michael Jackson tapes Rabbi schmy so welcome to both of you uh it's first of all it's great you're doing this uh you've had a public Feud for couple of years now uh you've torn into each other in various forums this is your chance to take each other on and at the same of this as I said in the intro there is a very serious Global story which is the Israel Hamas war and all the complexities that come away from that I want to give you both the chance to make an opening uh statement so Rabbi schmi uh you won the toss we didn't really ask you toss but we both agreed you can do this you go first your opening remarks thank you pierce for having me and Candace thank you for debating me I have spent my life bringing together the black and Jewish communities emphasizing that we share not only a history of shared persecution but of spiritual promise today we debate an American Tragedy a woman of unique eloquence who has abused that eloquence to become simultaneously the foremost anti-black rhetorician in all of the United States and the foremost anti-semite in America the statements that Candice has made against her own community that they cry wolf and constantly say that they're victims of racism her attacks on George Floyd a man who was suffocated to death for a $20 counterfeit note saying that he was a horrible human being a woman who went up in front of cek and said I was never a slave in America as if that's the only form of discrimination is what has led her community to call her not Candice but Candis the first ever female black woman who appears in her rhetoric against blacks calling LeBron James dumb and stupid an icon to the black community as Candis simultaneously you have the Jewish Community beginning to call her not Candace Owens but Candice ovens because her goal style rhetoric against Jews that Jews are nearly all pedophiles the state of Israel was set up a theater Herzel a pedophile as a Haven for pedophiles that Judaism is a demonic satanic uh cult that only protects pedophiles and by the way way her absolute obsession with Jewish sexuality and Jewish genitalia the first uh Lady of France bridet macron's genitalia is is disturbing it's one of the reasons I think she hates Sigman Freud so much because she's a Freudian field dream in terms of his arguments that the greater the sexual suppression and repression the greater we see violence but when you say that the Jews killed JFK because he was about to ostracize Israel when you invent all of these Fabrications out of whole cloth what is the result the result is the demonization of Jews that leads to violence Pierce just one week ago two days after Candice falsely accused me as she has for two years of being a murderer of threatening to kill her something for which she will face legal action because you cannot malign a rabbi and his daughter as murderers two days later I was swatted in my house were five police cars had to break into my house because Mayor Michael Wilds of Anglewood New Jersey received a an email arguably from one of Candace's followers after she said essentially what Henry II says who will rid me of this Troublesome priest which leads directly to the murder of Thomas Becket who today is a Catholic saint of course we were swatted and the FBI is now investigating Candace's rhetoric they're investigating interrup wait wait wait wait wait you now speak for three minutes fin point so Candace will get exactly the same amount of time it's up to you but this is an opening statement right and what I would say may I may I may may may I yeah may I just say finally if I may well if it's quick the biggest issue I have with the biggest issue I have with Candace to be honest is that she claims to be a Christian Candice didn't Jesus say You're supposed to love your enemies is the love you show me that you call me filth twice on the last show that you did with Pierce a piece of Filth you're to love your enemies turn is that turning the other cheek and Pierce you're you're an English gentleman I've known you for many years you allowed her to say that without even a piece of Filth when Jesus said that you're supposed to turn the other cheek where have you ever turned the other cheek when Jesus said that the meat shall inherit the earth the arrogance the nonstop attack against Jews the demonization if you are a Christian then I am the second coming of Christ okay that's four minutes you spoken to and out of fairness Candice if you want to use four minutes to respond you can all I would note Rabbi Shuli is you spent four minutes personally attacking Candis ens I set this up as a debate about what is happening with the Israel Hamas War anti-Semitism and so on and so on you've turned it all completely immediately into an ad homm Onslaught against candid how could How Could You Poss how could you possibly say that you are speaking to a woman who says the Jews are a ring of demonic pedophiles and you're saying that I have no right to defend my people you know Pierce you have to stop this once and for all there was nothing at homonym at all when Candace says that the black community is is a bunch of crying everything I said was policy I could not disagree more Candice will now get the same amount of time if you wanted Candace to respond thank you pierce and I don't think I really do need to respond to the ad hom attacks I think actually one of the things that plausibly unites people across all religions Muslims Jews Christians is that we all recognize that Rabbi schmi is unhinged he he's just mentally in my view unwell and I don't say that as an attack I say that as just a reality because I've never seen someone just make things up out of thin air that were never said and trying to screen that as a defense of black people the black people will never accept Rabbi schi after Michael Jackson put him on a list of people who he felt were ruining his life so you can stop your pleas with black America they won't work now going back to the context of what you've asked us to speak about today you know I think one of the things that the world is recognizing and what we've always recognized is that there are radical Fringe sect that break out within every single religion amongst every race there's white supremacy there's black Supremacy there's radical Islam there are all of these Christ Cults around the world and I think right now it's important for people to understand that radical Judaism is also a thing and you just you're watching an example of it right now on your screen the person sitting across from me or saying sitting next to me I guess it posted on his Facebook page in 2016 a tribute to someone who he said was his mentor Mentor that was Rabbi menam schneerson he said he was his mentor and his friend now for those of you who are not familiar with Rabbi schneerson there were some Jews uh uh who believed that he was and is the Messiah so rejecting Christ but believing that that Rabbi was his Messiah now you may remember in the news recently there was this radicalized faction of the lubich Orthodox community in Brooklyn that were digging tunnels in Brooklyn and hurling benches at police officers well and by the way this is per The Times of Israel that faction of individuals are followers of Rabbi schneerson so again you you have Rabbi schmi who who believes that that's his mentor they believed that he was the Messiah what is it that becomes important to understand what did Rabbi schneerson preach well he preached Jewish supremacism the hatred of all non-jews and you don't have to take my word for it because if I said it they would say that's anti-Semitism you should instead take the word of the two Jewish professors who translated his work those authors names were Israel shahak and nor mezvinsky and their book was entitled Jewish fundamentalism in Israel from that book we learned that shmi's Mentor schneerson describes the difference between a Jew and a non-jew and he says quote thus we do not have a case of profound change in which a person is merely on a superior level the body of a Jewish person is of totally different quality from the body of all nations of the world and he talks about the substance of the Jewish body versus the substance of non-jews saying that the in quality quote is is so different and so great that the body should be considered completely different species so that is a belief and you can go through his speeches and you will see that he continually talks about how non-jews should be treated and that again we are a different species this is what Rabbi schmy believes in we have to come to terms with the fact that there are Jewish radicals and it's incumbent upon the Jewish Community to call them out I'm glad that you brought up by rhetoric about black lives matter the organization and when which was basically allowing black to take to the street to to burn down to loot and to Riot in the name of racism because it shows that I I'm on equal footing here that across the board I do not support suprem supremacism whether it's coming from my community or whether or not it is coming from yours and I think the entire world is now paying attention and wondering what is going on in Israel what is this government is this a radical Fringe government and many people are concluding that the answer to that question is yes okay there's the two opening statements Rabbi schy let me ask you this where are we now with this war because it seems that the people inside Israel are now beginning to come after prime minister Netanyahu angry that his mission to save the hostages is simply not working we saw six more executed at the weekend obviously that's on Hamas but the the relatives of other hostages are saying for God's sake bring back back the hostages before it's too late and there's no sign of any deal being done to do that and there's a lot of pressure on Netanyahu is his mission statement failing yes I will answer that in just a moment but um pierce your guest just called me mentally unhinged she called me filth twice on your show you did not just say to her Candace can you stop the adamm attacks did I ever say anything I I stuck the policy can you at least just be fair and say that's unnecessary Candace or is just is this too against well no no you spent four minutes lacerating her calling me mentally unhinged is that is that call sitting there to defend that charge is that ad homonym you spent four minutes attacking her personally she's perfectly with all du respect with all due respect when when one of your when one of your guests calls someone else fil I think that you as an English gentleman should step in but let me answer your question no less the only thing of Christ that Candace Owens has actually fulfilled comes from Matthew 10:35 where Jesus says I've come to separate and create conflict between a woman and her mother-in-law and father-in-law my answer to your question about Gaza is that Lord Michael Farmer a courageous British Peer who happens to be Candace owens's father-in-law issued one of the most robust and beautiful defenses of Israel that any of us have read since October 7th he said that of course there's a lot of terrible Palestinian casualties God loves every Palestinian child as much as he loves a Jewish child he said that Israel has no choice but to fight this war because Hamas hides in residential areas and under nurseries he said that Israel the savagery of October 7th Demands a response he said that Israel is doing exactly the right thing and he said that he's doing all this in response to a quote high-profile member of his family the contempt to not even mention his daughter-in-law Candace ens because he didn't want to say her name and he didn't even say I love my daughter-in-law but because the British remember Hitler they remember the Battle of Britain they remember the V1 and V2 Rockets Candace Owens has actually now said that the Nazis were the good guys and it was the Allies the British people like yourself Pierce who engaged in the ethnic cleansing of 12 million people based on some documentary she watched called The Savage piece on the BBC which was wasn't even about the Alli she always distorts it was about to Czech Czechoslovakia a country that no longer even exists and as far as what she said about Michael Jackson putting me on enemies list that is a total fabrication it was invented by someone named deer vitner who sued Michael Jackson for 64 million tried to shake him down and Michael had to pay him $4 million I work to save Michael's life kandace st's never met Michael Jackson I was his Rabbi for two years I love him I missed him I tried to get him off of drugs she said that I killed him and talk about the contempt for people struggling with addiction that she would say the Jews killed Michael Jackson and with all due respect Pierce you have not said that one of those things that I'm a murderer a man who doesn't have a speeding ticket who doesn't have a park ticket is a murderer and the police have to come and the FBI to protect me are you going to say here's what I'm going to say to you reab once again you've just singularly failed to answer my question so if you're just going to continue every time I ask you a question about the war which is the point of the debate to Just Launch into Candice or her family or whatever that's your decision but in the interest time speak for minutes well hang on I'm not going to let Candice respond if you to Candace look it is it is obviously a matter of public record that your father-in-law Lord farmer did post on X what he posted um he concluded by saying I point out I'm the Christian Deputy chair of the council for Christians and Jews uh this was founded in 1942 as a bwalk against anti-Semitism um I mean do you want to say anything about what your father-in-law posted or anything else that Rabbi schy just said yeah I'm grateful that he brought that up and because it's very disturbing to to me to see him try to pretend that my father-in-law distanced from me or said something in favor of anything that Rabbi shmuli is saying he would never do that it is very important to understand that you know he does support uh Israel and he is re he has reaffirmed his support for Israel and you can imagine that within any family you have disagreements about things but fundamentally uh it's all love you know and it's good for us to have these conversations prior to him posting the statement I had just gotten back from vacation with him literally 48 hours earlier there is something incredibly demonic about a person trying to use the Bible at the beginning of a statement as he did trying to quote scripture and immediately following it up by trying to pull a family apart I mean that is utterly Unholy and I think the question of Holiness and what is Holy is is relevant to this discussion I think this is a conversation that a lot of people are having as well look prior to October 7th I don't think many people were engaged with what is happening in Israel we kind of all said the same thing Israel is our friend and Ally I account myself among those people post October 7th the world and especially I would say zionists in media were demanding that we all pay attention when we began to pay attention we didn't like what we saw you you cannot tell me to ever feel comfortable with 18,000 children being ruthlessly murdered you can't get me to feel comfortable as a a chrisan with the amount of explosive more explosives dropped uh tons of explosives dropped on God then we dropped in hirosima this doesn't make sense to me Gaza is 30 mil long 7 mil wide it's incredibly dense population and this is by the way according to heret that 40,000 uh Palestinians have been murdered I I believe they're getting those numbers from the Gaza Health Ministry and and here is what I would like to to say to you Rabbi since you're you're quoting scripture okay the one that's relevant to me is woe unto them that call evil good and good evil that put Darkness for light and light for darkness and if you'd like to dive into a little more scripture I think what's relevant is revelation 3:9 behold I will make them of the synagogue of Satan which say they are Jews and are not but do lie and I'm speaking directly to you Rabbi Shuli the fact that you would try to say I am Jewish and this is what I believe and and do and say the things that you are doing people can see and hear evil and what you are doing right now is an act of evil the lies that you are telling not just on me but also on my family members are a good example for the world to see what we are referring to when we call something radical Zionism okay Raby okay and and and okay thank you thank you and of course Pierce there was nothing ad homic about had hom my being demonic this is a two against one debate I expected that and it's not a two against one debate and I and I will excuse me no it's a two against one you made no attempt to answer my question no no no Pi Pier cand let me c has been trying to answer my just said you're not Candice just said Candice filth demonic there's nothing nothing at ham about that you are correct you you're you're right Pierce Candace Owens just said that Israel dropped more bombs on Gaza than on Hiroshima Hiroshima was an atomic bomb Candace you know why don't you just read Wikipedia Israel has nuclear weapons they've never used them so I have no idea what you're talking about now let's look at Israel's Justified defense Israel admits Israel admits and even Hamas admits to a one toone civilian into combatant ratio of of Civilian casualties which is a tragedy it shouldn't even be one but remember Hamas fires their Rockets from nurseries the United States in Afghanistan had a 4 to1 ratio of civilians murdered for everyone combatant in the Korean War it was 5 to1 in in Iraq it was at least 2 to one Israel has the lowest per capita ratio of combatants to civilians can cand should acknowledge it that is what we call a fact but you should also hang on hang on you should also acknowledge then that there is a unique demographic in Gaza where of the 2 million people who live there half of them are under 18 so that's a very different demographic to any of the other scenarios you're talking about that is what's caused so much international program against Israel is the fact that so many children Prat in the civilian death count have been killed it's that that people are so exercised about and rightly because what's happened here is obvious Hamas yes they've embedded themselves in in civilian territory yes theyve built all these tunnels none of these things are to be disputed but the problem with going after Hamas in the way that Israel has been doing is that the collateral damage as they would put it to so many thousands of children has now tested the patients of the world to a degree that vast Quant of the world are against it and want this to stop that's the reality I I think I think I think I think that's a very fair question you know and I don't like I don't like whataboutism but Candace ens never spoke out once against Bashar al-assad who killed 600,000 Arabs and he actually gased to death children he targeted them with mustard and poison gas you remember that President Obama said that's a red line and then he gave it to Putin to get rid of those weapons of mass destruction president Trump who actually wait wait wait wait wait just a second just president Trump God bless him actually fired 59 cruise missiles when Assad did that it's funny because people say that President Trump is anti-muslim he's the only one who protect protected mus Muslim life Pierce Hamas has ruled since 2006 they took they were they won an election jointly with the PA they took the Palestinian Authority representatives and threw them off of rooftops they then subjected the Palestinians one and a half million Palestinians of Gaza to the most ruthless persecution that we've ever seen they stole all their money isma hania who was assassinated in tyan is worth $4 billion now he's fighting with erdogan his kids over who's going to inherit that Khaled masal is worth $3 billion you and I both know that the Palestinians of Gaza got triple the amount per capita prated for our times of the Marshall Plan all of that money was stolen to build tunnels there isn't one bomb shelter the reason why people are dying in Gaza is because that money was used to buy pen houses in DOA Qatar there one bomb shelter that from from Kamas Kamas shoots and murders anyone who challenges their Authority they were elected in 2006 to a four-year term it's now 20 years later Kamas specifically and that's why they're being condemned by by the Palestinians right now they want Palestinian children to die because the more they die the more you will condemn me and Israel but let's remember Pierce you are part of your parents are part of the greatest Generation Winston Churchill was told by the American don't bomb German cities Hamburg dresen Etc during the at night you can't see what you're bombing do what we Americans have which is precision daytime bombing and Churchill said no my Pilots are more important we need the RAF right and he flattened German cities and he is considered today the greatest British States theth Century by the way the flattening of cities like Dresden was widely condemned at the time including by many people in Britain and led to the establishment of the Geneva Dr was only Dres was the last month of the war but before that Hur and everything else me it led to the establishment of the Geneva Convention after World War II specifically to stop that kind of thing happening again so I'm glad you raised that example Candice uh you've got over three minut do you so do you condemn do you condemn winon Churchill as a war criminal for Dres no absolutely not no why not you just said that it was wrong I actually Wiston Churchill as a war criminal for Dres please you said not but why the question let me be clear Winston Churchill was not a war criminal right but some of the ways that we he bomb res and killed 25,000 people yeah he also saved the world from Adolf hitam and Nazis oh he saved the world so Israel saving the Middle East from Hamas Islamic Jihad Iran but it's not Israel's not doing that thank you for answering my question case closed all right let me go to C um if I could just interject here uh just to respond to that I I I was going to say exactly what you said piis like Dresden was considered a holocaust it was in fact a war crime and there should be debates about what happened in dresin it was absolutely horrific that a bunch of Christians were skipping off you know on the eve of Ash Wednesday and then they were quite literally turned reduced to ashes it is wrong it and the fact that you are having having to reference a war crime to justify what's happening in Gaza is not a point for you it's it's completely awful it's when people say oh well look at what we did look at at all these other horrific things we did why do you care about this horrible thing that's happening I don't even understand that logic it's completely ridiculous look there is no person in good conscience who should be comfortable with the amount of death that's happening in Gaza and yes if you are going to correlate it to Dresden that would be a fair comparison except much more has been dropped on Gaza than was dropped in Dresden so is it fair to call what's happening in Gaza a holocaust is that what we're what we're looking after when you have this non-stop Onslaught and it's completely ridiculous to say oh well you know this is happening because of Hamas let's be very clear it is happening because the Israeli government will not stop bombing them okay so you had a very sympathetic audience all around the world myself included when October 7th happened there's not a single person that should or could justify the terrorist act that that was enacted by Hamas but the collective punishment that is being assigned to the gazin the people the Palestinians living in Gaza is also unacceptable and the entire world should condemn it and it should be made to stop and I do believe that a radical Fringe has taken hold of Israel and further evidence of that by the way is that we are not even allowed to critique Israel without having people like Rabbi schmi which I never said he threatened to murder me but he has threatened me for two years essentially trying to bully people into their belief that they have right said that I threaten to murder you we're going to post I never said that you threatened to murder me don't cut me off I did not off okay okay I cut I did not cut you off okay the the point is is that now what's happening Across America is that you have Zionist organizations that are threatening and bullying people because people are taking a stance against this act against humanity what they're doing is inhumane in Palestine and so what they're doing is they're saying this person should get fired this person should lose their job the Zionist Federation of Australia just asked for me to have my Visa banned simply because I don't support what Israel is doing and if that is what I have to pay if ultimately what happens I get my Visa banned because Zionism has a lot of money in media then so be it it's less of a price and than the children in Gaza are paying right now and as a Christian I will never support what B Netanyahu is doing right and what's interesting to me Rabbi hang on yes but let me just say again the question I put to you earlier it's not just people outside Israel who are now heavily criticizing Netanyahu and his government it is people inside Israel in massive numbers and so my question for you is why why are so many people inside Israel taking to the streets to demand that Netanyahu stop this war no they never said he should stop the war they said there should be a ceasefire to release the hostages because Israel is a cult don't interrupt me please Candice because Israel is a culture of life and every that's why Israel got into this mess for October 7th they traded 1,000 murderers including Yaya sinir who Israel saved at Soka Hospital in bersak when he had a brain tumor the Hamas Hitler who's the architect of October 7th Israel saved his life it's a culture of life even for Palestinian murderers they traded 1,000 for gilad Shalit you remember that and now a whole group is saying even if it leads to another October 7th I need my children home I understand that Pierce I have two sons fighting in this War I understand the dangers that are being faced no one's saying to stop the war not to destroy Kamas they're saying call a ceasefire to release the hostages because of their execution but I must respond first of all candas just said that Israel dropped more bombs on Gaza than on Dresden what's your source for that do you know that in Dresden there were 1,000 Lancaster bombers sent over two nights by Churchill and then 800 American that's 1,00 B what's your source that Israel Dro more than UND Dresden so it's just interesting because you realize that you Ed Dresden as an example no no no answer the question you just made no no no Pierce Pierce Pierce this is this is the question T you said that Israel you you just you just made a blood liable against the Jewish State Dresden 1,000 Lancaster bom over two nights I asking you what is your Source answer the answer don't interrup me please the answer is blood SM you can't you can't ask someone a question and then refuse to let them answer so I asked for a sour absolutely absurd I'm going to respond to what you are saying this tactic of When anybody brings up anything that Israel is doing is wrong you get to just scream a blood liel it is not a blood Li to talk about the amount of death and the tons of explosives that been dropped on the civilians in Palestine okay that is not a blood Lial against Jewish people this is such a nasty and perverted your essentially says I don't have to debate anymore because I get to just call everybody uh a person who's accusing me of blood lials okay truly what is happening right now is that the blood of Palestinians is being shed okay that is a liable against the Jews that is a fact and a reality against BB Netanyahu and this government which has gone extreme in their response to October 7th so stop this tactic understod Pierce can I can I now have my turn again all I asked was the source clearly she has none it was invented out of whole cloth that's what a blood liel is a blood liel is when Candice Owens says that the that the actual medieval blood Lial that Jews killed Christians and drank their blood she believes that she said she said she please don't interrupt me she actually says that there were Christian bodies found all over Europe when she said that I am not trying to kill her we will post right after this where she said it at least on eight occasions that's why she's being investigated by the FBI because you can lie about me you can call me filth and Pierce won't you know and you can call me psychotic I've never said that about you but what you can't do is incite violence against my family you have repeatedly said I'm trying to kill you you said the Jews killed JFK you said if we if if the Jews killed JFK said this ear president okay wait one second one second back for a moment no wait wait wait let's let's just go back for a moment no Pierce I have to respond to things would you like a Candice says that it is when Candice says it is demonic you want to S some Candice I never got I never got between you wanted the S some Candace I think she I think she has one well why don't you let her answer I think she has one let me and let me fact check this source as well so 70,000 I want to see where Israel Dr more, tons of explosiv have been dropped on the Gaza Strip let's see how many tons of explosives were dropped on Dresden one second you mean she said it and now she's factchecking it you're kidding me right you're you're asking me to give you the dire and going to look it up for you I don't I don't have a computer on me I don't have a computer on me this is ridiculous this is a cheat she question let her answer the question go ahead Candace so 2,700 tons of bombs were dropped on Dresden in an 800 bomber air raid and that is according to britanica the encyclopedia what was the tonnage of of bombs dropped in Gaza in Gaza it was 70,000 tons of explosives were dropped in the Gaza Strip and I got that from CNN through the duration of the war today is that the is that the time scale yes okay so R by SM that has surpassed so so so let's be clear let's be clear over 11 months she's compar she's comparing an 11mon War to a single night in Dres and that's clearly absurd I'm glad that she has her cheat sheat her her computer in front of her but notice she made the stat call blood liable not knowing what was she was talking about please hang hang on hang on what she said to be clear was the Israel it's also in the New York Times the Israel Defense Force had dropped more bombs on Gaza than were dropped on Dresden that is true do you accept that Rabbi schie you know you you know P Pierce I find this astonishing debate you ask I I wait wait first of all first of all first of all I don't wait wait what do you mean it's true because she said it's true no do you New York true is this a serious show wait wait wait wait wait every time I try to for a source you called it a blood had she made excuse me you are interrupting me she made a definitive statement she admitted she had no Source she had to then use her computer it's absurd that she has a computer doing this because because she had she had to look it up one second now now she's saying that over that over an 11mon war no we don't know that she's right because your fact Checkers haven't checked it and I my fact Checkers haven't checked it but let's just go back for a moment Israel was attacked in the most Savage way and women were gang raped their breasts were cut off Candice recently had a guest on who even did denies that women were raped now she's saying it's in the New York Times she said the other day that the New York Times lied and fabricated about the mass rape of women she had the former Press Secretary of Bernie Sanders who denies that now she suddenly likes the New York Times you are speaking to the number one critic of the New York Times in America when it's and by the way this is a typical thing Candice will say there's no racism in America then she will sue which she did the Stanford Connecticut Board of education for $40,000 settlement Against Racism she then went on a show and fabricated and said it wasn't a settlement it was actually for tutors for one month you tell me which tutors are paid $40,000 per month she will say that I have no right to bring up her family first of all I didn't it was her own father-in-law who condemned her but she can bring up briet mcon she can bring up Emanuel she can destroy their marriage obsess and you were very good on that pierce challenging her she can destroy other people's marriages and you know what's also hang the after wait wait wait wait wait one final point the day the day after the day after October 7th she said nothing for a few days never condemned it and when you asked her on the show she said Pierce I never talk about anything International is briet mcon an American she can speak about the genitals of the first lady of France for month but not the gang gra of Jewish Women I've already said to Cy I don't believe a word of the Bridget macaron thing what I would say about what you've just quoted Lord farmer as saying you said that he condemned Candice in the statement he put on X he didn't condemn her I just read it again and there's no condemnation of his daughter-in-law he simply set kiding read the first read the first line read the first line inew of public comments from a high-profile member of my family I want to put my own views on anti-Semitism and Israel's current military campaign in Gaza on public record where's the condemnation thank you very much thank you thank you thank you condemnation thank you so let's get the time so let's get the timeline Candace says she was on vacation her father-in-law two days before wait did he condemn her you and I you you you you and I can read between the lines on any press read she says you you a high just shown you he didn't cond her he he he absolutely condemned her he doesn't want say it's my daughter Candace and I and I love her but we disagree number two he went on to say that the Israel has every right he was distancing him himself for her repulsive op antisemitism he gave his own opinion why did he why did he why did he start by saying in light of a high-profile he gave his own opinion he didn't condemn her and didn't even name her cand he distanced himself from let me ask Candice a different question which is this cand is why why is it do you think that so many people in the Jewish Community believe that you are anti-semitic I think that's actually a very good question and and just to go back I'm going to answer your question I just want to make sure people are recognizing cuz he said a lot of stuff there he's not able to counter he essentially tried to hold me to looking up the sources we've now found the sources and it's the BBC it's the New York Times and it is the euromed human rights found sources check it after bombs were dropped on Gaza and per the BBC the British aircraft dropped 4,000 tons of bombs on Dresden so just for clarity a single Blood please don't cut me off I do not have not cut you off he called that a blood liel that is a strategy which is is meant to just distract people from the truth or looking into it you say everything you say is a blood liel now to answer your question Piers I think that's a very good question and the answer for that is because the media as an entity has been basically mining Jewish pain uh the history of their Pain by taking people out of context and presenting things that are as a fact that is simply untrue things that I've never said we are watching right now and that's why I'm grateful for you to provide this opportunity you are watching Rabbi schmi do this live right when we talk about yellow journalism and people that take things out of context and try to present it to people with a bunch of Hysteria and go oh my gosh Candace said this oh my gosh Candace is a holocaust denier oh my gosh he's called me all of these names and he doesn't have a single fact in there they just know that if they say those things it's a trigger it is reminition of exactly what was done uh for black Americans for a very long time they have now since changed their perspective on me but for a long time they thought that I legitimately hated being black and hated the color of my skin in because I stood against black lives matter as an organization and I stood against what black lives matter was doing and the media made them hysterical she's a black person who doesn't even want to be black and she's a black white supremacist they bought that narrative because when the media lies a lot of people accept that what their reading is true but of course I didn't hate Black America black Americans I didn't hate anything other than BLM abusing and Mining black pain going back and saying well it's going to be just like slavery to distract people from what was ultimately just a fraudulent organization that was actually going to bring more harms to Black Americans in the end and that's how I feel about the state of Israel and everything they're doing ultimately I believe it's going to to yield more anti-Semitism it's it's going to make people associate what BB net and Yahoo is doing to all Jews around the world and so I think it's important for them to realize it's these same exact tactics of manipulation the same exact name calling and AD homant attacks that is not based in fact and not based in reality but based in not wanting to answer the fair critiques that people have about what Israel is doing but that's that's a very good question okay Rabbi schy I mean there's someity to that argument I think is that too often I do see people IM IM immediately branded anti-semitic if they dare to criticize the Israeli government but there's a very big difference between criticizing a government and its actions and a whole people which is what anti-Semitism is and do do you accept that difference the beauty the beauty of is is a is it's a democracy you just said that hundreds of thousands of people are Marching against Benjamin Netanyahu I welcome those protests it shows that even during war listen in in 1864 the United States had a presidential election some people wanted to cancel it saying that how could you elect Lincoln when this is a civil war and they still had the election Israel is the same let's just go through Candace Owen's history of antisemitism that is unconnected I will let you do that I will let you do that and she can respond but on my specific point though do you accept is perfectly possible and indeed it it should be in a robust Democratic Society a central tenant of this that Israel's government and its prime minister should be uh criticized by anyone who chooses to criticize without the people who criticize being branded anti-semitic of course of course I am a very close friend of nany and I criticize him allowing Qatar Qatar is one of the most duplicitous evil governments in the world they house all of the leaders the billionaire leaders of Kamas I criticize Benjamin nany my dear friend for allowing money to go into Kamas and the belief that they could be bought off of I criticize the Israeli government for not recognizing The Armenian Genocide something that Candace own blames the Jews she actually says that Kamal aurk was led by the Jews to The Armenian Genocide by the way the Armenian Genocide took place under the ottoman Turks not not Kamal otot Turk she has no sense of history and she just fabricates con wait one second but let me let's just go through let's go through her history of anti-Semitism yes you said you had specifics of candy Owens being an being anti-semitic what are those examples okay okay you see you see the Jewish community did not want kandace Sans to be anti-semitic this is actually a tragedy that a woman gifted by God with such eloquence has decided to become a purveyor of hate and when when she said in 2018 that she has no issue with Hitler because if he was a nationalist but then he wants to go beyond her borders even then we didn't call her a that's an absurd thing to say that you had no issue with Hitler Hitler even domestically by then had enacted all the nberg laws there was already the November 9th 1938 hang hang just to clarify let's take these one other time what what do you believe she said about Adolf Hitler in the clip you're talking about she said that there was no issue with Hitler except for the fact that he went beyond his borders if he was enough it's domestic no but I believe no but my point is no one called her my point of fairness I'm going to play the the clip so that viewers who've never heard it can hear what actually got said yeah I agree I I actually don't have any problems at all with the word nationalism I think that it gets uh the definition gets poisoned um by uh elitist that actually want globalism globalism is what I what I don't want so when you think about whenever we say nationalism the first thing people think about in at least in America is Hitler you know he was a national socialist but if Hitler just wanted to make Germany great and have things run well okay fine the problem is is that he wanted he had dreams outside of Germany he wanted to globalize he wanted everybody to be German everybody to be speaking German everybody to look a different way that's not to me that's not nationalism um so and thinking about how it could go bad down the line I don't really I don't really have an issue with nationalism I really don't I think that it's okay it's important to retain your your country's identity and to make sure um that what's happening here which I think is incredibly worrisome in terms of the just the the decrease in the birth rate that we're seeing um in the is what you kind of want to avoid so I'm not I don't have anything problem I have no problems with nationalism it's globalism that I try to avoid so Candace on that specific point would you say that Rabbi smoly has categorized it correctly or not he's just openly lying and and that's why he didn't want you to play the clip I'm I was in the UK by the way I was at the Royal mobile Club there were Jewish journalists in the room and nothing was written about it until months later when somebody was working on a hit piece about me uh I was answering a question when they were saying how can we just embrace the word nationalism when it sort of has this dirty feel and I was just essentially saying that I actually don't have an issue with nationalism I think it's totally fine to be a British nationalist to be an American Nationalist and the problem is that it's wrongly attributed that word I think people instantly associate it with Adolf Hitler and I would argue that he wasn't actually a nationalist because obviously he invaded Poland and he went beyond German borders I didn't even mention Jewish people I didn't mention the Holocaust and suddenly you have people like Rabbi schmi who are pretending that I got up there and I defended Adolf Hitler it's just this isn't now please don't cut me off please do not cut me off a huge issue that that you have right now is this dishonesty if you really want to understand why Israel is facing a PR crisis why Zionism right now to people doesn't feel good and they don't want to associate themselves with it is because it seems like it takes such so many lies to maintain there's no reason to misrepresent what I said and to tell people that I support Adolf Hitler other than the fact that you want people to hate me and so I I'm I'm deeply appreciate the fact you guys had that to go well you may respond to what she just said that clip now you watched it okay okay um you know she keeps on saying lying I never said you shouldn't play the clip I'm actually happy you did she said if Hitler had only focused on domestic policy she would have had no issue with him his domestic policy was to the Christal burned down 3,000 synagogues in a single night domestically that was not in Poland that was not in czechoslov AKA his domestic policy was the 1934 Newberg laws his domestic policy was a complete dictatorship where he destroyed the bundestag and subjected and created daa under himler so those are the historical facts now let's but but what I said was even then the Jewish Community gave her a pass she explained it one mistake people make mistakes here's her history of anti-Semitism she's not going to be barred from going into Australia because of anything she said about Israel that is a fabrication she's going to be barred Australia is my wife's country born in Sydney she's going to be barred to go to Australia because she's a holocaust denier because the a 100-year-old victim of ysep mangela the angel of death's experiments um came forward and said you are going to traumatize me all over again she actually said that mangala's experiments the fourth worst person in Nazi Germany after Hitler himler Gobles mangala were was a fabrication she's an out andout Holocaust denier and and Australia God bless them took in so many survivors after the war and including my wife's family from Slovakia let me ask let she said that the mangala experiments were false go ahead let me ask Candice Owens now two things one are you a holocaust denier or do you accept that six million Jews were killed by the Nazis in the Holocaust and secondly do you believe that Joseph mangay did what he is reported to have done and has been since World War II ended thank you for those questions no absolutely I am not a holocaust dener this is again another fabrication based off of a monologue that I did in which I was putting pressure on the American government to explain why it is a fact that we learned all of these things about the horrific things that Nazi scientists did and to be clear Piers I did not even mention Joseph mangal's name in this in this skit at all I spoke about all the things that we learned that we were told over the years some of which ended up being rebutted and you know there were tons of you know that that part doesn't matter the point is the end conclusion of that is that the CIA via an operation known as Operation Paperclip took the Nazi scientists and brought them to America where they continued horrific experiments on Americans that's the full context of that so they pulled out a statement like one sentence where I said we've heard all of these sorts of things that they've done you know cut people in half sewed them back together and I said that sounds rid like a ridiculous waste of time and when you pull that clip Up by itself it sounds like I'm just diminishing all of these stories when in reality I'm saying let's take everything at face value let's say everything we've ever heard was true why on Earth would the American government acest to Bringing these scientists over to America and as a fact Dr mangay was not one of the scientists which was brought over to America so that just to be clear you accept hang on I'll come to you RAB SMY to be clear you accept the Nazis murdered six million Jews in the Holocaust yeah I have never once in any of my appearances I'm just askar denied the Holocaust atrocities ever and you accept that Joseph mangay was a Despicable man who perpetrated horrendous crimes including experimenting je people were all all of the scientists the Nazi experiments that were done were horrific and that's why I was saying they were so horrific that it makes you go why on Earth with the American government in a in this clandestine operation bring over the Nazi scientists who then became a part of our CIA and continued experiments onto America through to the 60s and the were that was done throughout the Korean War your response and I read it after this debate we will post every single clip that was an complete and utter fabrication what she said was that she doubts that any of this happened because it was as she just said a waste of time the whole Holocaust was a waste of time Hitler had no winter equipment for his soldiers in Stalingrad under General paus in 1942 because the box cards were taking Jews to alitz you see that is what hatred is Candice it's where you hate so much that it becomes self-destructive it's what's happening to you you're a very gifted eloquent broadcaster you are self-destructing before America's eyes because you have some issue with the Jews not with Israel so let me continue you actually said that Theodore Herzel was a frankist by the way when you attack frankus as a bunch of Jewish pedophiles you forget to mention they all became part of your religion they all converted in 17 1957 to Catholicism you always ommit that but you said that Theodore Herzel was a frankist and you said he set up the state of Israel as a refuge for pedophiles this is before Gaza this is before Rafa as a refuge for Jewish pedophiles you always refuted referred to Jews as pedophiles it's the main word you use about Jews and every historian knows that what began in norch in 1099 with the first Blood liel where the Jews were falsely accused of taking a Christian Child and drinking his blood you actually believe that you said that Christian bodies this is before Rafa this is before Israel that Christian bodies were found all over Europe and when you speak about pedophilia you know it's funny you just converted to Catholicism in 2002 Pope John Paul II a pope that you would probably like he was very conservative he was a great man great friend of the Jewish Community recognized the state of Israel sent an ambassador in 1994 he apologized very fresh to the world Catholic Community saying that at least 2% of all Catholic priests were pedophiles later Pope Benedict the 16th apologized again I met Pope bened a great man great friend of the Jewish Community he said it was 4% then Pope Francis raised it probably even higher 6% we know a million people almost a million people children in France alone according to the French government were abused by Catholic priests but you've never once condemned Catholic pedophilia everyone knows it was the biggest scandal in the world but only the Jews are pedophil is that anti-Semitism okay let me ask Candice do you condemn pedophiles in the Catholic Church Christian pedophiles yeah he's just lying again um actually on my show I spoke extensively about frankis and I told people that there was a conversion into the Catholic faith and one of the things that I believe is that all of the abrahamic religions have been infiltrated by satanists and that is what I've said so they've decided to pull apart only the piece where I'm talking about Judaism and not where I'm speaking about all of the faiths having been infiltrated and speaking about how it's important for everyone to recognize this so that you can realize that there is this sort of satanic cult that's operating within all of the faiths and I think that they use Christians and they use Jews um and and Muslims as well I've said that on my show multiple times so he's just absolutely lying about that I think the difference here is that you could never you'd be hardpressed to find a Catholic that would in any capacity defend pedophilia now regarding what he is saying that I said Judaism is filled with pedophiles that is objectively a nonsense I Christian I'm aware of what the first five books of my Bible are that would be me insinuating that okay well the first five books of my Bible are inspired by pedophilia that's absolutely false what I said and I'm hopeful that this is something that the rabbi will agree with is that it is a fact that Jewish pedophiles American Jewish pedophiles escape and run and hide in Israel where they are given Safe Harbor by the government that is a fact they will not extradite our pedophiles that is an absolute nonsense given the many billions of dollars that we give to Israel that we can't get back the men that are raping children okay and I can't imagine a single person that would think otherwise that that is not a nonsense and that we should not be giving back those pedophiles and to be clear it wasn't Kenneth Owens who researched and came up with this it was an incredible Jewish organization that looked into this talked about how wrong it was and brought it into the mainstream media if you don't like that Israel is harboring pedophiles that's not on me that is on the state of Israel okay again I am condemning this is for Haring pedophiles and not extr them do you have a disagreement there Rabbi if so please share thank you Candace not only is that an absolute lie and Fabrication against Israel the most famous example the country that will not now that will now B you from entering because you're a holocaust denier not because of Israel because a 100-year-old experimente of mangela came forward and said do not subject me to this trauma and the inter wait well she just said it no no no but she she Deni she denies M call some Holocaust deny when they literally just said 6 million Jews got killed in the Holocaust wait wait wait that's not holoc wait second come on come on come on Pierce you're more subtle you're more subtle than that say say that you can say course you could be a holocaust an why don't you let me answer please you could say that 6 million Jews were accidentally bombed by by by Curtis lame and by bomber Harris and they and there was no zeyon B there's a there's she said that manget did not do those experiments by the way this is not my decision this is a government of Australia that is Bing her let please don't interrupt me Candace the most famous example in Australia of a Jewish pedop of a Jewish pedop please don't please don't interrupt me the most famous example of a Jewish pedophile was a woman named Mal she was a religious woman from Melbourne Australia and she apparently abused 74 children she ran to Israel she was prosecuted by Israel extradited the entire she is in Australia being prosecuted right now this is a total fabrication and it comes down to what Candice has the most unhealthy obsession with Jewish sexuality notice that everything we all know that the Vatican of course of course took Cardinals like the Cardinal Archbishop of Boston and gave them the highest positions in the Vatican she has never criticized that only Israel she she now Candace let me ask you a pointbank question did you say that Theodore Herzel you said he was a frankist or descended from frankist again frankist all became Catholic he was Jewish did you say that Theodore Herzel set up Israel as a Haven for Jewish pedophiles okay first and foremost I just want to debunk your claim that what I said was a lie it is in CBS news and it was the Jewish Community Watch an American organization that tracks accused pedophiles who has been trying for years to find a specific pedophile they are the ones that brought this to the Forefront and CBS News partnered with them what's the name of the pedophile what's the name of that pedophile I just gave you a name ala aler what's the name of that pedophile well they were tring down pedop now let's go let's go now let's go to the Vatican how many people they allowed how many Cardinal Arch Bishops were protect don't cut me off please don't cut me off you you told a lie and so I'm debunking it live for you uh the pedophile they were they're looking for what's the name I'm trying to say it for the third time his name is Jimmy Julius C you're looking it up the Artic me you said all this and you had no idea title of the article in CBS News is entitled how Jewish American pedophiles hide from Justice in Israel CBS News teamed up with a Jewish organization and came to this conclusion because they were the ones that brought it to the Forefront so courageous Jewish people who are we really need someone to read off the internet inate this is okay say the theater created the state of me say we are getting too Obsession sidetracked into pedophilia when this no this is one critical Setra I want I want to end we got to end the debate and I want to end the debate by giving you both this opportunity right you are both religious people right every religion reports to be peaceloving right religions are supposed to spread peace and Harmony and love and respect and kindness whether you're a Catholic as I am as Candace is whether you're a Jew as you are Rabbi Shi so I'm going to ask you both and I'll start with you Candice to say something nice about Rabbi schi be a Christian what would you say yeah you know I I actually deeply appreciate Rabbi schi having a platform it's not something that I've said I want his platform Stripped Away because I think that he does more in terms of revealing what it is that I'm speaking about when I when I'm talking about radicalism than anybody else and so in that way I'm I'm grateful that he has a platform and I would never call for him to be banned from anywhere I I I hope he gets a megaphone and I think watching his behavior today do you see any Saving Grace as a human being you know I think I will pray for him I will pray for his conversion into Christianity I I don't think it's normal to to lie like that and feel nothing but he continues to do it he you know he's filing FBI reports against me over Pizza I don't have any hatred in my heart towards Rabbi I really don't like I've said I I hope he forever has a a platform because I think that it showcases to the world what it is that I'm speaking about when we speak about radical Zionism okay Rabbi do you want to say something nice about Candace ens absolutely she is gifted by God with Incredible eloquence I think she can repent and sees being a force for hatred against the black community who call her Candis who have rejected her utterly she is one of the most despised women in America by the black community she's doing a whole new tour to be re accepted I think she can use her eloquence to apologize instead she said she essentially hinted that the only reason she attacked the black community for the past four years calling them stupid and dumb and can't vote for themselves and cry wolf and racism was because she was forced to do so at the daily wire I call it the daily Li maybe maybe that's correct but I think she should take personal responsibility saying that Israel was created as a Haven for Jewish pedophiles by theore Herzel is not the way she's going to repent saying that she defends Kanye West when he says he loves Hitler Hitler killed 10,000 Jews a day 3 911s a day for four years between 1941 and 1945 one seconde I know the greatest coming it's fine we've heard them but but but but say something nice said I think she could use her eloquence to repent that's all and I think finally I think finally that if Candice could F could just come forward and admit that as a Christian Jesus said clearly that you cannot approach him except through the Jews he said that the Jews are the root and Christians are the branch the fact that we in the community consider her the number one anti-semite in America means that she cannot relate to Jesus so I'm saying become a Christian that's a nice very nice thing to say the fact that Jesus said I am sent only to the lost sheep of Israel come and learn about the Jewish Jesus you know what Candace I'll give you a free copy of my book kosher Jesus it teaches you about the Jewish Jesus that me shall inherit the earth love your enemies turn the other cheek don't say and stop calling me a killer stop saying I'm trying to kill you you said it over and over again you are you are saying what Henry said rid me of this Troublesome Prest I think we've established your struggling to find nothing nice to say about Candice uh but I appreciate you both coming on together for this debate I think it's been very illumin ating and thank you for doing it thank you for being uncensored thank you very much Pierce thank you thank you
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