Charlie Kirk Warns Britain Has Become a Husk of Its Former Self in Fiery London Interview

[00:00] Earlier today, I sat down with the

[00:01] American conservative political activist

[00:03] and social media sensation Charlie Kirk.

[00:06] He's part of a new wave of young

[00:08] proTrump personalities who have risen to

[00:10] prominence with unwaveringly loyal media

[00:12] and podcast appearances since the

[00:14] president trounced Democrats in the

[00:16] election last year. Charlie has 5

[00:19] million followers on X, 6 million on

[00:21] Instagram, and millions and millions

[00:23] more across Facebook and Tik Tok. He's

[00:27] known to have the ear of President Trump

[00:29] and indeed the Trump administration,

[00:31] reportedly recommending JD Vance to

[00:33] serve as vice president. During the

[00:35] run-up to the 2024 US election, the

[00:38] 31-year-old toured 25 different

[00:40] universities in the United States as

[00:41] part of his you're being brainwashed

[00:44] tour. And as part of this tour, he held

[00:46] rallies encouraging Marxist students to

[00:48] debate him on a wide range of topics.

[00:51] Should I have to be forced to call a

[00:53] grown man a woman? I think it comes down

[00:56] to respecting if you don't. Uh, so I

[00:58] respect them too much to lie. So I will

[00:59] call them sir, not ma'am. What should

[01:02] the penalty be when someone breaks into

[01:03] the United States of America? Personally

[01:05] me, I think we should help them get

[01:06] processed. Do you invite random people

[01:08] into your home and be like, "Hey, you

[01:10] could just squat on my floor and eat my

[01:12] food. Make eye contact with me, please."

[01:13] Like a man. Wow. People who Wait, so you

[01:16] acknowledge that I'm a man? What is a

[01:18] woman? I did not ask about that. I'm not

[01:21] a woman. I don't care. I wouldn't know.

[01:22] I'm asking you about What is a woman?

[01:27] I sat down with Charlie today in London

[01:29] ahead of his tour of Oxford and

[01:31] Cambridge universities. And I began our

[01:33] chat by asking him what President Donald

[01:35] Trump thought of the UK. What about you?

[01:38] You're massive. You're a massive

[01:40] conservative leader in the US. I'll call

[01:42] you that. I mean, you've been credited

[01:43] with uh helping getting Donald Trump

[01:45] elected uh and even advising him on

[01:47] cabinet picks, right? So, you are very

[01:49] very in influential. What do you and

[01:51] conservatives and the Trump admin in the

[01:54] US think of the UK? What's your

[01:56] perception of the UK right now? I mean,

[01:58] as a country, and I'll get to the

[01:59] government. I mean, sadly, this place is

[02:02] a husk of its former self. This this

[02:04] place needs to get its mojo back. I

[02:06] mean, this is the place that split the

[02:08] atom and invented the steam engine and

[02:09] brought common law to the world. And

[02:12] unfortunately, the perception amongst

[02:14] American conservatives is that this is

[02:16] increasingly a conquered country and

[02:19] that there is not a firm opposition to

[02:21] try to bring Britain back to greatness.

[02:24] I I hope that's reform. We'll see what

[02:26] happens. It certainly isn't labor and,

[02:28] you know, Kier Starmer and all the

[02:29] nonsense that he's doing in this

[02:30] country. But look, I mean, we want this

[02:33] country to be great. America is Britain

[02:36] obsessed and we talk about the royal

[02:39] family all the time. If you come in with

[02:40] a British accent, we take you more

[02:42] seriously. My friend Steve Hilton, who

[02:44] is an adviser to Cameron, is literally

[02:45] running for governor of

[02:47] California. There we we love this

[02:49] country from afar and we're really sad

[02:52] about what's happening to it and what

[02:54] has happened to it. And I think that

[02:56] there's a potential political revolution

[02:58] that can happen in this country. I know

[02:59] it cuz I've lived through several with

[03:00] reform you talking about. I don't even

[03:02] know. Yes. But like I hope so cuz I like

[03:04] Nigel, but I'm not here to tell you what

[03:06] to do politically. I hate when

[03:07] foreigners come to America and say,

[03:08] "Vote for Republican, not Democrat."

[03:09] Like, "Okay, calm down. You don't live

[03:10] here." All I can do is as an outsider,

[03:13] kind of like Dtoqueville coming to

[03:14] America. I can tell you right now as an

[03:16] outsider who's seen themes and trends

[03:18] and patterns, there is an explosion

[03:20] waiting to happen in this country, there

[03:22] is mass repression. And here's why.

[03:24] People are coming up to me quietly, me

[03:26] as an American who follow me on social

[03:28] media, Charlie, I love what you're

[03:29] doing. I wish I could speak out against

[03:30] it. There's so much the silent majority

[03:33] is what we called it in America. And

[03:35] President Trump tapped into that. And

[03:37] these are the muscular class of London.

[03:39] These are the people that are building

[03:40] your hotels. They're driving your taxis.

[03:43] They're the ones that really make London

[03:44] work. And they are so animated about how

[03:47] this country has been run down down the

[03:49] gutter. What do they make then? What

[03:50] does Donald Trump You're good friends

[03:51] with JD Vance. You know, you've got

[03:53] you've got Donald Trump's here. What do

[03:55] they make of Kier Star and this Labor

[03:57] government? I don't know. I know

[03:58] President Trump was very uh positive

[03:59] about the trade deal and he said that

[04:01] was good dealing, you know, with Kier

[04:02] Starmer. I don't want to put words in

[04:04] their mouth or sentiments. I know that

[04:05] that as a totality of Europe, they want

[04:08] Europe to pay more in their

[04:10] contributions to NATO. I can give you my

[04:12] opinion of Kier Starmer, not a fan. Go

[04:14] ahead. Stop it. Uh well, look, I mean,

[04:16] first of all, what he's doing with this

[04:18] Brexit thing based on my limited

[04:20] understanding, and again, as an

[04:21] outsider, is like the ultimate denial of

[04:24] democracy, you guys had an up or down

[04:27] vote of the highest turnout election in

[04:29] modern British history ever. Right. ever

[04:32] in the history of the country, right?

[04:34] And they lost and people said no. When

[04:36] you had 80 plus% turnout, people did not

[04:38] want to be part of the European Union.

[04:40] And now Kier Starmer is undermining the

[04:42] democratic will of the people. That is

[04:45] not a democracy. And these are the

[04:47] people that are always saying, "Yes, you

[04:48] know, we're very big about liberal

[04:49] democracy." No, you're not. You're about

[04:50] an oligarchy. Your oligarchy is an

[04:52] expert class permanently entrenched. Not

[04:54] a fan of Kirst. Obviously, politically

[04:56] ideology, you know, he's a far-left

[04:57] winger. I would even almost put him in

[04:58] the Marxist camp at times. what he's

[05:00] doing in immigration is a total fraud.

[05:02] No one should actually believe it. Um

[05:04] well, I'd say as well, it's not just

[05:06] Labour who who opened the flood the

[05:07] floodgates. It was the Conservative name

[05:10] of the Conservative party cuz in America

[05:12] conservative means something very very

[05:14] different. Well, that's the scam they've

[05:15] been pulling for the last decade calling

[05:16] themselves conservatives and they're

[05:17] anything but they're liberal Democrats.

[05:19] Their left of center is being generous

[05:21] actually. Yeah. And like I mean Hillary

[05:23] Clinton would be like a right-winger

[05:24] compared to some of the people in the

[05:26] conservative party here. And you're

[05:28] right, it the Conservative Party allowed

[05:30] the mass migration crisis of Britain and

[05:32] Kirstma just happens to now be prime

[05:34] minister trying to, you know, make

[05:36] justifications for it. But this has been

[05:38] I I hate to use this term. I don't know

[05:40] if it's term you guys use bipartisan.

[05:41] Yeah. Uh which like it's bipartisan of

[05:43] both conservatives and labor that have

[05:45] now overseen this crisis. We call them

[05:47] the uni party here. Yeah. Exactly. We

[05:49] have a similar term in America. I think

[05:51] there is a opportunity for an ascendant

[05:54] political force. I don't know if it's

[05:55] reform because of the social media era

[05:58] because people are consuming information

[06:00] in a decentralized way because they're

[06:02] not just getting information from BBC

[06:04] and from the the gatekeepers of the

[06:07] information of Britain and I think it's

[06:09] a huge existential threat to the power

[06:12] brokers here in this city and country.

[06:13] You talked about immigration being one

[06:15] of the big levers there, the change in

[06:16] culture and society. Can I ask you do

[06:19] you think I mean you guys have had a

[06:20] similar situation on the southern border

[06:21] just I hope you guys understand it's

[06:23] worse it was worse in America than what

[06:25] you have 100%. Yeah I mean we both per

[06:27] capita and the volume and we have this

[06:29] ridiculous idea that I don't even think

[06:31] you guys have which is called birthright

[06:32] citizenship which is like if you just I

[06:34] hope you I hope everyone watching

[06:35] understands how insane it is in America.

[06:37] Can you just explain there's some things

[06:38] you guys get better than us. A Chinese

[06:41] woman from Beijing can fly in 9 months

[06:43] pregnant, land in San Francisco airport,

[06:45] go straight to the hospital, get a

[06:46] C-section, and that baby's a US citizen.

[06:48] Full US citizen, full passport, no

[06:50] reservation, no asterk, nothing. That's

[06:53] called birthright citizenship. So all 10

[06:55] million people come across the border,

[06:56] if they have babies, of which 250,000 a

[06:58] year, all of them get US passports. We

[07:01] call those anchor babies in America. So

[07:03] it's a it's it's a problem that Joe

[07:04] Biden manufactured. 10 million people in

[07:06] four years, about 30 million people

[07:08] total. We don't actually know the entire

[07:09] number, but immigration is a number that

[07:11] is a issue that transcends political

[07:13] minds. And I think here in Britain, you

[07:15] guys are finally kind of getting into

[07:17] the willingness to have that

[07:18] conversation. Okay. Can we talk about um

[07:20] have you had a lady called Lucy Connelly

[07:22] since you've been here? Of course. I

[07:23] talked about her yesterday and no one

[07:25] knew who what I was talking about in

[07:26] Cambridge. Who are we talking about? Who

[07:27] the students didn't know? I mentioned

[07:29] her cuz I did the research. My team did

[07:30] an amazing job and I think she just had

[07:32] her petition denied in the in the last

[07:34] hour or so today. It's Tuesday today.

[07:36] She's had her appeal denied. So, she's

[07:38] going to be carrying out her two and a

[07:39] half year sentence four solitary tweets.

[07:42] So, outrageous. She deleted four four

[07:43] hours later. What's your take on the

[07:45] whole situation? Well, I'm going to try

[07:46] to get the US State Department involved.

[07:47] I don't know if you know what their

[07:48] bandwidth is here, but I'm sorry. Like,

[07:50] again, I'm speaking as a citizen, not as

[07:52] US government. I just want to be very

[07:53] clear. Like, is this a way that a

[07:54] liberal democracy and an ally of the

[07:56] United States acts? Just to be clear,

[07:58] what she said would not be any prison

[08:01] time in America. I don't like what she

[08:02] said, but she showed contrition. Well,

[08:04] there's two parts. the first part where

[08:06] she said like I don't want immigrants in

[08:08] my country. Perfectly acceptable. That's

[08:09] fine. You can say that you're allowed to

[08:10] have that. I think there was one part

[08:12] about like potentially like violent

[08:14] whatever. Well, she said, let me clarify

[08:15] what she said. Yeah. I want to be clear.

[08:17] So So I think I think by by the time she

[08:19] sent the tweets, some asylum hotels were

[08:21] in the midst of being burned down or

[08:23] their molotovs thrown through a window.

[08:25] She tweeted, "Burn them down for all I

[08:27] care." You're allowed to say that in

[08:30] America. So, so the argument is was she

[08:32] inciting via or or was she reacting to

[08:35] the images she was saying? You could.

[08:36] And by the way, just to be clear, you

[08:37] guys have the wrong incitement threshold

[08:39] in America, you need to have specific

[08:41] time and specific place in order to

[08:44] reach the incitement threshold. Every

[08:45] day people say, you know, well, someone

[08:47] should go kill Charlie Kirk. I don't

[08:48] like it, but that's protected speech. In

[08:50] America, we care about what you do, not

[08:52] about what you say. And then she showed

[08:54] contrition and she apologized. And from

[08:56] my understanding, when the police force

[08:58] showed up to her door, they asked her

[09:00] questions being like, you know, do you

[09:02] think that do you hate immigrants? No.

[09:04] She gave like very satisfactory answers

[09:06] and they still arrested her. And I just

[09:08] find it so outrageous that she's going

[09:09] to now jail for 2 and 1/2 years for a

[09:12] deleted social media post that she

[09:14] apologized for. I as as you guys have

[09:17] birthed free speech the world, you now

[09:20] guys are becoming a totalitarian

[09:21] country. You just mentioned the US State

[09:22] Department. I mean, what what do you are

[09:24] you inclined to do? What do you I don't

[09:25] know. I mean, I'm going to I'm going to

[09:26] bring this up to Marco Rubio. I'm just

[09:28] going to send him a text being like,

[09:29] "Hey, you have a whole department, you

[09:31] know, and he's done an amazing job, by

[09:32] the way. Marco's incredible." Like, this

[09:34] should be mentioned. And by the way, cuz

[09:36] not it's not new. JD Vance brought this

[09:38] up in Germany. the the context of Lucy

[09:40] Connelly, the her argument is that she

[09:41] fired off that tweet because she'd lost

[09:43] in tragic circumstances a 19 month old

[09:46] dehydration and she was so shocked to

[09:48] the core about seeing three little girls

[09:51] massacred in Southport near Liverpool

[09:54] that that's why she reacted in that way,

[09:56] but she deleted it 4 hours later. But

[09:58] but again, this is what this is what's

[10:00] so wrong about how you guys are not you,

[10:02] but your country is viewing this. Who

[10:03] cares the circumstances? You're allowed

[10:06] to say these things and the fact that

[10:08] you guys are policing speech,

[10:10] unspecified speech of someone that then

[10:11] deleted their tweet or their social

[10:13] media post. I mean, you guys know the

[10:15] reference. I mean, this is this you are

[10:17] becoming Orwell's 1984. This is wrong on

[10:20] every fundamental moral level. Is the

[10:22] Trump admin I know JD Vance has

[10:23] mentioned it before. Is the Trump admin

[10:25] aware of that? Is Donald Trump broadly?

[10:27] Yes, I'm sure. Again, I don't know all

[10:28] the specifics. Look, there's like five

[10:30] different dynamics here. were trying to

[10:31] get, you know, the war in Russia and

[10:33] Ukraine and like there's a lot of

[10:34] different levels here. I do know the

[10:36] State Department is keenly aware about

[10:38] the assault on free speech throughout

[10:40] Europe. And again, they always preach

[10:42] like we're the bastion of democracy. You

[10:44] do not have a free liberal democracy

[10:46] without freedom of speech.

[10:51] All right, there we go. There's going to

[10:52] be a longer version put online. You can

[10:55] get it on YouTube and a second part to

[10:57] that at 10:20. So, in the second hour of

[11:00] this show, we talk about religion, we

[11:02] talk about immigration, Brexit as well.

[11:04] Uh, so stay tuned for that. And as I

[11:06] said, the full version will be on

[11:07] YouTube. Let's get the thoughts of my

[11:08] panel now. The Conservative MP Esther

[11:10] McVey, GB News presenter, Alex

[11:12] Armstrong, and the political commentator

[11:14] Andy Williams. Good evening, panel.

[11:15] Welcome. Evening, Esther. I'm sorry. I I

[11:18] threw the Tories under the bus there in

[11:19] that chat with Charlie. And of course,

[11:22] always can't be trusted. 16%. You mean

[11:25] Liberal Democrats? I wasn't right behind

[11:27] the sofa as I wasn't. Yeah. Anyway,

[11:29] what's your thoughts on that? You're uh

[11:31] the US and people like and I must let me

[11:33] just stress again as well and Alex,

[11:34] you're you're you've got big history in

[11:36] the US. Charlie Kirk is probably the

[11:39] most influential conservative

[11:41] commentator in the United States. He was

[11:43] credited with largely helping Donald

[11:45] Trump get elected. He's good friends

[11:46] with JD Vance, the vice president. He

[11:48] recommended JD Vance to Trump. He's he's

[11:51] pretty much uh credited with getting him

[11:54] that position.

[11:56] So he's not just some tick tocker who's

[11:58] a good talker and quite eloquent. He is

[11:59] very influential and he's saying the

[12:02] United States looking at us and thinking

[12:04] oh my god what is going on in the United

[12:07] Kingdom? Well I guess there's a couple

[12:09] of things isn't it? We have been

[12:10] battered with a series of events over

[12:12] since about 2008. Uh people said there

[12:15] would be once in a lifetime once in a

[12:17] generation of uh events and they

[12:18] weren't. So we had the financial crash,

[12:21] we've had co and lockdown. We've had the

[12:23] first war in Europe. we've come out of

[12:25] Europe. So, I think all of those things

[12:27] happened at the same time. So, have we

[12:29] been battered and brood and do we need

[12:30] to recover from it? Yes. But I would say

[12:33] do not underestimate the UK. Thank you

[12:36] very much indeed. For a small country,

[12:38] we punch well above our weight. We've

[12:40] defended the world not once but twice.

[12:42] We were the start of the industrial

[12:43] revolution. uh the internet the computer

[12:46] we gave the world cricket rugby uh and

[12:50] uh that's what was saying so so what I'm

[12:52] saying is yes we have gone through a

[12:54] difficult time but I am a strong

[12:56] supporter of the UK and I know that as

[12:59] individuals and as a nation we have

[13:01] resilience we have brilliance and we'll

[13:04] go forward and I do think there is a a

[13:06] struggle at the moment with our British

[13:08] identity we don't want to be hiding our

[13:10] light under a bushel anymore we have to

[13:12] march forward and I Um, you're talking

[13:15] about whether you're a li Dem or a

[13:16] conservative. I am a strong conservative

[13:18] who you're one of the few genuine top

[13:21] working class worked my way up. So I

[13:23] agree with social mobility and

[13:24] opportunity. So yes, we do need to find

[13:26] our way. But I don't need an American

[13:28] telling me how to do it. No. Do you know

[13:29] what? I don't think Charlie I don't

[13:31] think people like Charlie Kirk are

[13:32] saying this stuff, Alex, because he

[13:33] wants to dunk on the UK. They they love

[13:35] the UK. As he said, he says it out of

[13:37] concern and out of out of fear. We are

[13:40] condescending either. Well, I think it

[13:42] is condescending. I think you have to

[13:43] accept some some criticism from from

[13:45] good friends when it's justified. No.

[13:47] Yeah. Yeah. It's like when you're in a

[13:48] bad relationship, you'd want your

[13:50] friends to tell you, "Listen, this isn't

[13:51] healthy for you." And that's kind of

[13:53] where our country's headed, particularly

[13:54] on things like free speech. I do get

[13:56] very, very worried about that. I don't

[13:59] believe people should be in jail for

[14:01] tweets along the lines of what Lucy

[14:03] Connelly wrote. I actually agree

[14:04] completely with Charlie Kirk. The

[14:06] threshold is too low. Um, I think when

[14:08] people start saying dates, times,

[14:10] locations, that sort of stuff, then you

[14:12] are probably organizing a very violent

[14:14] rally. But I don't, when I look at her

[14:16] case, I don't see intent for her

[14:17] genuinely to cause harm to people. And

[14:19] as he said, she showed contrition. We

[14:21] need to be able to look, at the end of

[14:23] the day, there's also a man who's who

[14:24] came over to this country illegally. He

[14:26] was sentenced the other day, put into

[14:27] prison for 9 months for posting a video.

[14:30] I think it was a Palestinian migrant who

[14:32] came to this country, broke into our

[14:33] country and posted a video about how

[14:35] Allah should uh destroy all the Jews or

[14:37] something along those lines. I'm not

[14:38] quoting exactly. Uh people can look at

[14:40] themselves. 9 months. Okay. So, there is

[14:43] to most people a two-tier system in this

[14:45] country. It is dangerous for democracy

[14:47] and it's dangerous for the health of

[14:49] Britain going forward. I want all those

[14:50] things that Esther is saying, but we

[14:52] need to get back to our our roots first.

[14:53] Andy, do we have free speech in this

[14:55] country? Yeah, obviously we do. I mean,

[14:57] the idea that we do not have free speech

[15:00] that obviously interject so quickly, but

[15:02] it's not that obvious. Lucy Connley has

[15:03] been banged up for for for saying

[15:05] something on Twitter and deleting it

[15:06] four hours. So, if you if you can let me

[15:08] have more than three words in a

[15:10] sentence, I think that would be fair.

[15:12] Um, it's absolutely clear that we have

[15:16] free speech in Britain. And anyone who

[15:18] can argue that we don't, I think is on a

[15:21] ludicrous platform. You know, we have

[15:24] rules that guard the guard rails around

[15:28] free speech. Now, we could have

[15:29] different interpretations of free

[15:30] speech. Some of us would think that

[15:32] we're, you know, you Ben, I think you're

[15:34] a free speech absolutist. I think that's

[15:36] not not that's your view. It's not my

[15:40] view. I think the America, the

[15:41] Americans, my definition of free speech

[15:43] is akin to America. Yeah. As in you can

[15:46] say what you like and that's fine. That

[15:48] is not my view. My view is there have to

[15:50] be guardrails around free speech because

[15:52] if you're inciting violence then is it

[15:53] well I think if you're inciting violence

[15:56] or hatred or saying things that will

[15:58] cause people to commit harm on others I

[16:03] do think that's the test now Lucy No

[16:06] hang on so so Lucy Connley is in prison

[16:09] because she has violated so there's two

[16:12] things here firstly Lucy Connley's

[16:14] violated the rules of our country and

[16:17] that is why she's in prison Now, you may

[16:19] agree or disagree with that law, but

[16:22] that is the law as it stands today. So,

[16:24] if you stand for a rules-based system,

[16:27] you must agree that Lucy Connley should

[16:30] be in prison. You could agree or

[16:31] disagree with the sentence, but she is

[16:34] in prison for that reason. This is where

[16:35] I'm coming. It's a total

[16:37] disproportionate sentence what she was

[16:39] given. And there's a couple of factors

[16:41] here that don't make sense. Invariably,

[16:43] the judges are at pains never or not to

[16:46] send women to prison. They would try not

[16:49] to. And if they've got children, they

[16:51] absolutely will try their best not to or

[16:53] with a shorter sentence. This didn't

[16:55] happen here. And the other thing that

[16:56] you'd have when you are in prison and

[16:58] you're coming to the end of the sentence

[16:59] from last November, she would have been

[17:01] allowed something like rottle, which is

[17:03] sort of release on temporary license.

[17:05] She would have been able to have gone

[17:06] and seen her husband who's ill and her

[17:08] child who fell and she never got any of

[17:10] that. But what I will So, she never got

[17:11] any of that. And that's why I say

[17:12] disproportionate. But what I will say

[17:14] when and judges do this and they did it

[17:16] in the riots of 2011. Should people do

[17:19] something at a time of rioting, civil

[17:22] disobedience, they give sentences which

[17:25] is to say do not do this. They are

[17:27] disproportionate in a time of rioting

[17:30] and they did that. But now I think it's

[17:32] gone on too long and I do think what

[17:34] they're doing is quite unnecessary. But

[17:36] don't you think just before just before

[17:38] because I think this might add into what

[17:39] you're going to talk about when we when

[17:40] we look at rulings for people who being

[17:43] deported for example right we see judges

[17:45] make decisions based on different

[17:47] different articles of the ECR like a

[17:49] right to a family life for example they

[17:51] must stay here and we give a lot of some

[17:52] of the ridiculous ridiculous things that

[17:54] judges obviously different categories

[17:56] let people off for we aren't showing

[17:58] leniency when it is due and I do blame

[18:01] the government for this because Kama

[18:02] came up very very clearly and said he

[18:04] wanted these people locked up quicker

[18:06] than they could blink and that is a part

[18:08] that's part of the problem when

[18:09] politicians are calling the the calling

[18:12] for the system to so this is

[18:14] interference of of the separate arms of

[18:17] here's what I would say if you send a

[18:18] tweet that's and by the way let's be

[18:20] clear when you post on social media that

[18:23] is publishing you are publishing no one

[18:26] disagrees with that no one disagrees was

[18:29] wrong she deleted it she admitted it was

[18:31] wrong and she said that set fire to all

[18:33] the hotels she didn't say that yes she

[18:35] No, she didn't. Andy, what did she say?

[18:36] You tell me what she said. She said

[18:38] well, tell me what she said. What was

[18:39] the tweet? I don't I don't want to I

[18:41] can't repeat it because we're Repeat it.

[18:43] I'm giving you permission to to repeat.

[18:44] She said, "Set fire to all the

[18:46] hotels and

[18:49] apologies for for the swearing there."

[18:51] And what was the tweet? It doesn't

[18:53] matter what it doesn't matter. It does

[18:55] not matter. The whole the whole this

[18:57] conversation about the tweet is here.

[18:59] Mass deportations now set fire to all

[19:01] the hotels for all I care. That's what

[19:03] we're debating. for all I care. Is that

[19:06] inciting? Well, the courts have deemed

[19:07] it so. And again, I'm not defending this

[19:09] tweet. I'm just saying for all I care.

[19:10] My argument is she was not inciting

[19:12] people to go and set fire to hotels. She

[19:14] was saying for all I care that can

[19:15] happen. I'm not I can't I can't believe

[19:17] we're arguing this semantic point. She

[19:19] said set fire to all the hotels. That is

[19:22] clearly incitement. She also

[19:25] acknowledged it was

[19:27] wrong. Yes. She took it down 4 hours

[19:29] late. So she did air Cola. Everybody

[19:31] agrees it was a vile tweet. It was

[19:33] wrong. There was a sentence for it. She

[19:35] did. Everybody's got that. It is about

[19:37] the

[19:38] disproportionality. I agree with that.

[19:40] She's been prison. Yeah. Sorry. Sorry to

[19:42] interject. Just finally, do you think

[19:43] she's a political prisoner the way it's

[19:45] gone so far? Obviously not. No.

[19:47] Obviously, she's she's got a 12-year-old

[19:49] child who deeply misses her mother.

[19:51] Yeah. And I'm coming back. You said no.

[19:53] She She's got a 12-y old child who

[19:54] deeply misses her mother. Her the father

[19:56] of that child is ill and she's a child

[19:58] minder. She had no previous convictions.

[20:00] She the court heard today. I was reading

[20:02] the the appeal uh transcript from the

[20:04] court. The court heard that she was

[20:05] sending private messages WhatsApp to

[20:07] friends in the days after that tweet

[20:09] saying you expressing her fear that it

[20:11] could have been her own children. Say

[20:12] and then she went back onto Twitter to

[20:14] to make calls for no more violence in

[20:16] the riots. You know, none of that was

[20:17] taken into consideration. So is it 31

[20:20] months her sentence? Is that right? So

[20:22] that seems to me like a disproportionate

[20:24] sentence. Do I think she should have a

[20:25] jail sentence? Absolutely. I think a

[20:28] deterrent is really important. She broke

[20:30] the law. I I wrong is that she's being

[20:32] made. She's very little

[20:35] sympathiz rightly so. We need to make an

[20:38] example. That that's that's mob. I want

[20:40] to know why she's not getting rottled

[20:41] and being able to go home for two a week

[20:43] a month. All right. We got to move on.

[20:44] We'll continue this because we've got

[20:45] the uh the second part of the Charlie

[20:47] Kirk interview coming up in the next

[20:48] hour. So, we will continue this. Thank

[20:50] you panel. I'm going to get a little bit

[20:52] deep now. The the the trans situation

[20:55] medical experiments on kids mass

[20:57] migration. Is it intentional? Is it not?

[20:59] I used to be of the premise the thought

[21:01] that I didn't think there was good and

[21:03] evil per se. I used to think well people

[21:05] have different perspectives and you know

[21:07] give them a bit of uh you know benefit

[21:08] of the doubt and just kind of think you

[21:10] know we've maybe been brought up in

[21:11] different environments. I am now after

[21:13] seeing many many different situations

[21:15] over the past couple of years Southport

[21:16] the murders for example as a as an

[21:18] example that evil exists. Do you think

[21:21] evil exists in the world? I mean, I I

[21:23] I'm I'm an evangelical Christian and

[21:25] just like, first of all, I just think

[21:26] that this materialist secularist lie I

[21:29] saw at Cambridge that everything is just

[21:31] atoms and matter. There's a supernatural

[21:33] domain. There's a realm out there that's

[21:35] supernatural. Every civilization that's

[21:37] ever existed acknowledged this except

[21:38] the last like 200 years we thought we're

[21:41] really super smart because like actually

[21:43] no, we're just a bunch of subatomic

[21:45] particles and you're just a bunch of

[21:47] chemicals in your brain. No, there is a

[21:48] spiritual dimension. And there is a

[21:49] supernatural realm. And of course, evil

[21:51] exists. As an evangelical Christian, we

[21:53] believe evil has kind of like a chief

[21:55] executive officer, Satan or Lucifer. And

[21:58] we believe Christ our Lord is the not

[22:01] just the counter, but is the salvation

[22:03] for all of humanity. And I want England

[22:05] to believe that again, cuz you guys

[22:07] brought Christianity to so much of the

[22:09] world. I want the Church of England to

[22:10] get its its mojo back. I was going to

[22:12] say, do you think what's happening in

[22:14] the West over this I'd say 20 years? Do

[22:16] you think what's been happening over the

[22:17] past 20 years is because of a lack of

[22:19] faith in maybe not God but just faith in

[22:21] something bigger than ourselves or I

[22:23] would say yes. I mean something

[22:25] transcendent I mean look the can a

[22:28] civilization continue when it cuts off

[22:30] what gave it

[22:32] life? Probably not. And that's what

[22:34] modernity is flirting with right now.

[22:36] And so then you get all these

[22:38] counterfeit religions. You get

[22:39] environmentalism. Why do you guys think

[22:41] you guys are doing this insane

[22:43] netneutral carbon stuff by 2050? Yeah.

[22:45] So, you get rid of a substitute form of

[22:48] earthship. You get rid of Christianity

[22:50] and then you get a substitute for

[22:52] anti-racism. You get rid

[22:54] of more dangerous, you go from

[22:57] secularism than to Islam because then

[22:59] you're like, well, we have to believe in

[23:00] something and then you you bring in a

[23:03] completely different ideology that's at

[23:04] odds with Western values. People

[23:06] watching this now would say it's just

[23:08] Islamists who are the issue. Islam as a

[23:11] as a religion is peaceful by nature. so

[23:14] on and so on. What's your response to

[23:16] that? I know a lot of great individual

[23:17] Muslims. My primary doctor in America is

[23:20] actually a Muslim and he's amazing.

[23:21] That's not the point. You could walk the

[23:23] street and meet a great Muslim in

[23:24] London. The question is, is macro Islam

[23:27] compatible with Western values? Macro?

[23:30] Of course it's not. There are three maj

[23:31] major reasons why Islam does not believe

[23:34] in freedom of speech. Islam does not

[23:36] believe in freedom of religion. And

[23:37] Islam does not believe in separation of

[23:38] mosque and state. Those three things are

[23:40] antithetical to the West. In a Muslim

[23:43] majority country, you are not most

[23:46] Muslim majority countries, you cannot

[23:47] criticize the prophet Muhammad. In most

[23:50] Muslim majority countries, you do not

[23:52] have the same robust freedom of religion

[23:54] protections. And finally, whereas we in

[23:56] the west are very careful to try to

[23:58] intermix religion and state. They are

[24:00] commanded to actually go into the state

[24:03] and try to change the state to be more

[24:05] Islamic around the core pillars of

[24:07] Islam. And the last thing I'll finally

[24:08] say is I cannot see a single western

[24:10] country that has become more Islamic and

[24:12] has become a better place to live that

[24:14] is happier or freer by by what metric

[24:16] just happiness quality everything from

[24:18] quality of life from cultural cohesion

[24:20] from whether people want to live there

[24:22] from uh from I mean prior to the

[24:24] nativeorn fertility rates again people

[24:26] watching this will say there are is your

[24:28] criticism of the religion itself or not

[24:30] Muslim people because there are there

[24:31] are British Muslims you'll have to

[24:33] caveat it all the time I know you guys

[24:34] have to cuz you're British and all that

[24:36] a culture ceases to exist We don't have

[24:37] unified language when you do not have

[24:39] when you cannot talk to your neighbor.

[24:41] I'm not discounting that there are good

[24:43] individual Muslims. The question that we

[24:45] need to reckon with the west is

[24:47] compatible with the

[24:49] teachings of Blackstone. Is it

[24:50] compatible with the legacy of

[24:52] Wilburforce? And and and the great

[24:54] thinkers that have come from this

[24:55] country and I will say no. There's a

[24:57] reason why when you go to these Islamic

[24:59] countries that you're not going to see

[25:01] the equal protection of rights, that you

[25:03] do not believe in universal human

[25:04] equality, that you do not believe the

[25:05] same things that we believe in the West.

[25:06] And I think it's suicidal to import

[25:08] millions of them. Yeah. And you know

[25:09] what? Just a passing point on that. It's

[25:11] most of the time, as far as I'm

[25:12] concerned, it's not even multicultural

[25:14] because there was an example in there

[25:16] was a school a few months ago during

[25:18] Easter which cancelled Easter

[25:20] celebrations out of respect for other

[25:22] other faith. So it's not as if it's

[25:24] multi the word multicultural and

[25:26] multi-iverse doesn't include

[25:28] Christianity. No. And again, this is

[25:29] this is the red green axis and Britain

[25:32] is at the forefront of this. You have

[25:34] the Marxists that have infiltrated your

[25:35] government and the Islamists that are

[25:37] coming to your country. And when they

[25:38] combine together, they both agree on one

[25:40] thing. They have huge disagreements on a

[25:41] lot. They hate the West and they want to

[25:43] see it broken. Okay, we're finishing up

[25:45] because we're pushed on time. You have

[25:46] to get to Oxford tonight, right, for

[25:47] more battles with some lefty students.

[25:49] But I have some quick fire questions. Go

[25:50] ahead. Where's Elon Musk gone? Oh, he's

[25:53] around. He's running his companies. He

[25:54] disappeared. Where's Oh, no, no, no.

[25:55] He's just not on TV as much. He's around

[25:56] the White House. He's around the

[25:57] Eisenhower Executive Office building.

[25:59] Remember, he's running like multiple

[26:00] trillion dollar companies. Oh, no. He

[26:02] was very prominent in the first couple

[26:03] months. Everybody taken a step back.

[26:06] Yes. But there's also like a legal thing

[26:07] too. He's what's called a special

[26:08] government employee. So there's only so

[26:09] many hours you're allowed to spend on

[26:11] stuff. But it is noted that look, he was

[26:12] very very present the first like couple

[26:14] months. He set a lot of causes in

[26:16] motion. I think you're going to keep

[26:17] seeing a lot of them.