Charlie Kirk's Prediction Comes True, AGAIN

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[00:45] It's become very clear in retrospect

[00:47] that Charlie Kirk was holding the right

[00:50] together and that we need JD Vance to

[00:52] step into that role which will require

[00:54] settling disputes and laying out the

[00:57] boundaries of the coalition. Nixon

[00:59] figured out how to do this after being

[01:01] vice president. So, and then someone

[01:03] said, you know, Vance should have his

[01:04] own podcast, which we've had him on a

[01:06] few times and we should hopefully do

[01:07] that again in the future. But yeah, I

[01:10] think that's for those who aren't aware

[01:11] who are watching there's been a lot of

[01:12] discussion of this online because

[01:14] there's been uh a lot of arguments

[01:16] within the right over you know for

[01:18] example when Tucker interviewed Nick

[01:20] Fuentes what are the barrier yeah on the

[01:22] Israel question on different on foreign

[01:24] policy questions on a lot of stuff

[01:26] what's uh up for debate what's not up

[01:28] for debate what's beyond the pale and

[01:30] you know Charlie was such a coalition

[01:32] builder he was so interested in keeping

[01:35] the focus on get wins against the left

[01:38] Don't you know Charlie would not have

[01:40] been having a big fight over what the

[01:42] right should believe a week before the

[01:43] elections in Virginia and New Jersey.

[01:46] And I think it's very important to

[01:47] emphasize that and I'm glad you were

[01:49] emphasizing it Chris.

[01:50] >> Yeah. And so Chris Yeah. build on why JD

[01:52] why do you see him as uniquely

[01:53] positioned to be that person? Well,

[01:56] look, I mean, I think again in

[01:58] retrospect, I saw it and you know, I

[02:00] remember during the transition period, I

[02:02] talked with Charlie and he called me and

[02:04] he said, "Hey, I need great names for

[02:06] people to staff the Department of

[02:08] Education. I'm down at Mara Lago. We're

[02:10] trying to pick a great team." And that's

[02:12] the moment that I realized that he was

[02:14] someone that in public had this huge

[02:17] role, but also in private, uh, he was

[02:21] essential in figuring out how to get

[02:23] good people together that were focused

[02:25] on the mission that were going to

[02:27] deliver results. And I I I think I

[02:29] didn't quite understand that and

[02:31] appreciate that until after he was gone.

[02:34] And and then there's this sense of a

[02:36] void. there's no there's no one that can

[02:39] stitch together the various coalitions

[02:41] into the MAGA movement into the into the

[02:44] general right. He was really just an

[02:46] incredible leader in that regard. And as

[02:48] I'm looking around for other people who

[02:49] could fill his shoes and serve in that

[02:52] same capacity, the first person that

[02:54] obviously comes to mind is the sitting

[02:56] vice president of the United States. Um,

[02:59] you know, he JD has great relationships

[03:01] with all the various factions on the

[03:03] right. He of course has the bully pulpit

[03:05] of being the vice president. That's

[03:07] actually quite helpful to be in a

[03:09] powerful position and he can really

[03:12] gatekeep in a unique way kind of

[03:14] offering the access to the white house,

[03:18] offering access to uh uh you know the

[03:21] office of the vice president uh and then

[03:23] getting people in line. And look, the

[03:26] right is facing this question now.

[03:28] Obviously, it's very chaotic. Many of us

[03:31] wish that we weren't doing it, for

[03:32] example, right before election. Uh, but

[03:34] the cat is now out of the bag. And I

[03:36] think we need to resolve these questions

[03:38] sooner rather than later. And I think

[03:41] the vice president has the authority,

[03:42] the credibility, and more importantly

[03:45] the relationships to get the job done. I

[03:47] could see why he would want to kind of

[03:49] let things maybe resolve naturally. Uh,

[03:52] but I hope that he steps up and I hope

[03:54] that he can be a galvanizing figure.

[03:57] hope he can be a figure that uh really

[03:59] sets uh the boundaries and also sets the

[04:02] direction uh so that all of us can be

[04:04] you more effective in our work.

[04:06] >> Yeah, I want to let's uh let's Charlie

[04:09] was of course a big fan of the vice

[04:10] president very hard for him to become

[04:12] vice president and senator before that

[04:14] and so let's go to the man himself. Uh

[04:17] this is Charlie on JD. Let's play 158.

[04:21] >> We recognized his gifts early on. I saw

[04:24] the talent and I said this is the guy.

[04:26] This is the one. JD Vance has become

[04:29] such a warrior for our cause in the past

[04:31] six months. JD Vance

[04:33] is acting and looking like the vice

[04:36] president that Donald Trump needs, the

[04:38] vice president that Donald Trump

[04:39] deserves and maybe beyond that, even the

[04:42] 48th president. We're a long way from

[04:44] that. We shouldn't even think or talk

[04:46] too much openly about that. But he's a

[04:48] rockar. He's smart. He's capable. He's

[04:51] humble. He's phenomenal. And what an

[04:53] upgrade from what we had during that

[04:55] last administration.

[04:57] [laughter]

[04:58] >> Unclear if he's talking about uh Joe

[05:00] Biden's or Trump 1.0 there, but um it it

[05:04] probably would have remained probably

[05:05] true from Charlie's perspective on

[05:07] either. But yeah, I mean, listen, Chris,

[05:09] JD has the built-in advantage of not

[05:12] only being the vice president, but you

[05:13] know, Charlie in death somehow has taken

[05:17] on even more important uh of a of a

[05:21] position within the movement

[05:23] symbolically, spiritually, uh, and and

[05:26] of course the the words that he spoke

[05:27] out and all these clips we have of him,

[05:29] he was in JD's corner a billion%. I can

[05:32] tell you this from the first time we had

[05:34] him on the show years ago when it was

[05:36] just talking about

[05:37] >> he'd always say people would say like

[05:39] Charlie you should run for president.

[05:40] He's like I don't need to JD run for

[05:42] president. [laughter] Yeah.

[05:43] >> Yeah. So that I mean that holds a

[05:46] significance within the conservative

[05:47] movement this that that Charlie was such

[05:49] a huge proponent of his.

[05:51] >> Yeah. I I think that's right. And I

[05:53] think again he really set the example.

[05:55] If you see how Charlie dealt with kind

[05:58] of right-wing racialism, right-wing

[06:01] conspiracism, the groper movement more

[06:03] broadly, uh he was trying to kind of

[06:06] create good boundaries that would

[06:09] benefit. And he understood that

[06:10] sometimes there is uh you addition

[06:13] through subtraction in a political

[06:14] coalition. There are certain groups that

[06:16] you want to manage and there are certain

[06:18] groups that you want to manage out

[06:20] because ultimately they detract. And the

[06:22] end of my tweet was a reference to

[06:24] Richard Nixon. And if you look at the

[06:26] history of Nixon, um Nixon was derailed

[06:29] in his 1962 campaign for California

[06:31] governor by the John Burch Society,

[06:34] which in that time represented a more

[06:36] extreme form of right-wing conspiracism.

[06:39] They of course were famous for attacking

[06:42] President Eisenhower as a you know

[06:44] communist agent. Uh and by the 1968

[06:48] presidential campaign, which Nixon won,

[06:49] and then in 72, which he won by, you

[06:52] know, an overwhelming margin, winning 49

[06:54] states, he learned how to successfully

[06:57] kind of uh cut through uh uh the these

[07:00] thorny questions, how to create a

[07:03] successful coalition that galvanized

[07:05] huge majorities, and also how to edge

[07:07] out some of the kind of negative

[07:09] influences, some of the net negatives

[07:11] like, you know, the John Burch Society.

[07:14] He he had this sophisticated strategy of

[07:17] strategic distance without getting

[07:19] sucked into a a a debate with uh the

[07:22] Birch Society. And I think that for

[07:24] someone like JD uh a similar approach

[07:27] could be quite effective. Uh look again

[07:30] Nixon won 49 states. I think he has uh

[07:33] he demonstrated one potential model for

[07:36] this uh that could be uh very important.

[07:39] And of course, Nixon uh was, you know,

[07:41] formerly served as vice president. And

[07:43] so that's why I think the historical uh

[07:46] example might be useful and might offer

[07:48] a a plausible way forward.

[07:51] >> Yeah. I think I think you know there

[07:53] this this is the debate. I mean what

[07:55] you've just isolated is the you know and

[07:58] Buckley played a big role with you know

[08:01] who who was in who was out. I mean it's

[08:03] a it's I can't tell you how many people

[08:05] have sent me the Buckley example uh

[08:07] going back to those days and you know

[08:09] it's it's a it's a really tricky

[08:11] question.

[08:12] >> It is a tricky one because like for

[08:14] example you could say some of Buckley's

[08:17] influence meant that we had like that

[08:19] anti-intervention anti- uh immigration

[08:23] faction of the right was was too low for

[08:25] too long and that caused a lot of damage

[08:27] to the movement and the country

[08:28] arguably.

[08:29] >> Yeah. And I think I think it's so and I

[08:31] will say, you know, and I mean,

[08:33] >> let's just name names. Let's just do it.

[08:34] Uh, and Chris, you can you can either

[08:37] choose to engage or or not. I mean,

[08:39] that's a it's kind of what you're

[08:40] talking about, the strategic. Well,

[08:41] let's not get sucked down to it, but you

[08:42] know, sucked down into this sort of like

[08:44] uh I would say counterproductive in

[08:46] fighting. And I agree with you that

[08:48] there are opportunities where we need to

[08:49] sort of say, hey, you know, this is a

[08:51] this is a line too far. It's a bridge

[08:53] too far. Um, but you know, a lot of

[08:55] people, and we've said it on Thought

[08:57] Crime, I think we've said it on this

[08:58] show as well. You know, a lot of people

[08:59] are asking us to to distance ourselves

[09:01] from from Tucker given everything that h

[09:04] that's happened. And I would say,

[09:05] listen, one of the last things that we

[09:08] were asked to do or that Charlie made

[09:10] very clear to us was that, you know, I

[09:12] will not be, you know, morally

[09:14] blackmailed uh when it comes to Tucker

[09:16] Carlson. He's my friend. I believe in

[09:18] him. And you know, listen, we have a I I

[09:21] understand a lot of the pressure that

[09:22] comes with the fallout from that

[09:24] interview. I understand a lot of it. Um,

[09:26] you know, but you know, it's it there is

[09:29] a relationship there. There is a history

[09:31] there with Charlie and Tucker. And so,

[09:34] uh, just to say say it really clearly,

[09:37] uh, that's that's not going to happen.

[09:38] now debates the collision of ideas at

[09:41] Amfest. Trust me, we are pursuing every

[09:43] single uh means and I think it's a

[09:46] worthwhile debate to be having about

[09:47] what is our foreign policy, what should

[09:49] it be with regards to how much we spend

[09:52] on foreign nations, what you know, is

[09:54] there a line between moral and financial

[09:55] support? Is there a line between boots

[09:57] on the ground? Certainly, I think the

[09:58] movement is consolidated and um uh I

[10:02] would say very united when it comes to

[10:04] boots on the ground, but there are

[10:06] really important conversations that

[10:07] deserve to be challenged in a public

[10:09] forum uh from different perspectives.